Dec 4, 2009|
Tom and Todd talk about the leaked emails and Copenhagen. Climate Change is here...
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Warm welcome back Tom Skinner NE AU while listening to veterans forum on AM 680 WRKO on what is turning out to be a bright clear brilliant day. Not probably not quite as warm as yesterday Abby Nelson but -- nonetheless they're more AM beautiful early December day lies ahead. And itself always great day -- rarely -- we set a record yesterday -- clear volume by three of four degrees of talk about global warming you knew was coming soon to a to a city near you move the chair for you a sixty degrees in December resembling real and absolutely so it is Abby Nelson that's the voice of Bobby Nelson who today for the so vacationing Todd vibrant ought to be back next. Week specifically I believe on Wednesday unless it decides to extend this vacation -- always a delight to be without -- knows how I think nowadays. I'm not good enough. Fun ends. I'll listen to the carts meant hello my lot paid here is this is that just I am fascinated by the story of climate -- eight email gate how I don't know how to. Even describe its -- at a college climate gate. As to the -- and as we approached this Copenhagen. Global climate change summit. That president Obama's gonna go and make specific commitments in the united to stay -- for the picking up his Nobel Peace Prize I'll tell -- -- that's something like that you are allies who have rebels which is why are you so much. But this this is an absolutely incredible story. That the story behind the story is that these emails were hacked there was a hacking into a you know how they got how they got released. Scott okay but did you know it is and he is the is the client climactic. Research unit. Unit at the university of east. -- and there are scientists over there have been become deeply involved in the study the research of global climate change global cooling however argument describe it. And -- hackers got into the accounts and have now shared literally it's gone viral it's all around the world. Emails from these scientists. That seem to. Quality. There's no tiptoed around it. They seem to her -- and suggest -- -- those tiptoeing and attitude that they are not going to even accept. For consideration. The research the findings or conclusions of people who was skeptical about. The projections that and they were actually begin the emails reveal that they were coming up with ways of trying to sabotage the the data was on. The other side and even. Apparently of even implying that they were manipulating the data to come up with the results. That showed that this did not show any cooling trend yet it's it's amazing stuff -- you think of it so how out of the again the accusation are at least the inference that's Althea now based upon the release of easy emails. Is that scares scientists in -- in reports that were sceptical sceptical of global climate. We're gonna be given very short shrift to. They were not going to be up allowed to appear in the scientific journals that all science is scientists refer to. That it somehow or -- did not meet the peer review standards. Of the people at the other university and they were shaving a manipulating. The around data so was an attack on anything that was hostile to what they hoped for conclusion was big as well as an embellishment. An -- dressing up if you will of the wrong data. In the city -- mother of god. I expect this from people who hold off us. They gonna do a little -- and -- are gonna be a little song Indiana -- little sign Indians here you know little -- -- -- has -- -- razzle -- routine. But from scientist you expect okay. His to research that I did he is what I observed here -- my findings and conclusions. In that means it's out differ every other scientists to test independently. That -- Nero. There's another point here and that is they have somehow -- they have conveniently and this is nothing to do with the hacking. They apparently have gotten rid of some of the raw data -- -- that talked about that the temperature rise over the last 10050. Years. Getting rid of the raw data means other scientists were no longer contest that and that's exactly right have to give some context here one of the arguments that the people who scientist. Who and others and politicians who support the global warming hypothesis. And even the global warming have -- has to be refined. If so the word vision issues and throughput Janet which means that human beings are causing and -- think if the climate. He's getting warmer because sunspot -- -- doing about that it's being done by humans that's different. One of the arguments -- news is that all the people who disagree with this have had no articles published in so called peer reviewed journals peer review. Means that in in most important. -- periodicals scientific periodicals and others in other fields as well when you submit a paper it is sent to two or three. Experts in the field they review of the paper the names are deleted should know you don't know the author. And you don't know the reviews -- often does -- the review unless they choose to communicate with each other. And they give presumably a detached and dispassionate or disinterested -- evaluation of the paper and it goes into the journal and that's a high standard. You know share this having published in science -- version peer reviewed journal. That's the standard this given -- people say they haven't published in peer reviewed journal they make it sound. The air force if this work is not have a high enough caliber to get into these journals now we find that the peer review process. Has been corrupted because some of these people who are involved in the process and are connected with the journal's. Have been engineering. He may be the data. And the literature and the decision and his decision they've been preventing these articles from appearing in the journal they conspiring to do that it is so -- Of scientific fraud is that that they be involved and the head of the horse's name Jones has now stepped down because of. It is it really is it's an amazing story to get most of us including many -- with civilians we don't have a basis from which to critique this -- you feel. If you're frustrated because you say look. I don't mind being legitimately and accurately informed if in fact climate change global warming is occurring. I'm not afraid of hearing that if in fact it's dispassionate. And objective if that's a conclusion fine I'll live with that I know America -- in the world can and will adapt -- different ways that's okay so I'm not worried about it. It's when somebody become so politically or emotionally invested in the outcome. That they decide to distort. The data in -- the process you just every great great summary let me get a quote to -- -- have. This guy Phil Jones he's the direct dollar has been the director of the climatic research unit at the University of East Anglia. He you know in a July 2004 email he dismisses as quote garbage. The work of two dissent just on this fellow scientists who came up and said wait a minute. Our research so shows a different outcome so that they'll listed as dissenters right. Quote I can't see either of these papers being in the next IP CC report he -- fellow scientist Michael Mann of Penn State. Kevin and I will keep them out somehow even if we have to redefined. What the peer review. Literature. Is so they gonna change the rules of the game so that dissenting voice doesn't get any air time doesn't get any oxygen doesn't get any light whatsoever it's as if -- how did you. -- -- I mean we we expect integrity in the process. In terms of presentation or scientific material and for these people to be sabotage -- this Michael -- that was mentioned he's from Penn state university and I think. He too has been asked. He did -- reviewing their there investing and I don't know if he's been asked to step down or but but he's caught up and it now well if this is that he really serious. And -- you 6172666868. You've you hey you've we've got -- the scientist he he knows what peer review literature is he's -- -- let's go right to John John -- next -- they would not -- in job. Okay good morning guys. -- -- -- -- -- -- -- Briefly remote. -- a couple of -- starting to get a lot of good stuff. All of moos has argued that -- shouldn't positive attitude towards what should we do not care about it not. A little bit but not so much sarcasm about what we shouldn't -- -- are loaded technical Billups stood there and -- about segue into. They do this currencies so -- bitterness that you and I both Cuban gonna superb -- -- drove this issue. And I have only I was expecting a lot of comments to make well you read them all except for -- and and that is so the blogger didn't bark why there's just not so first I've heard are being. Reported on AB CNBC -- Well it's still hard drive. Where -- -- idea compliments to lesser. Deeply appreciated but we'll let us compliment you back for making. A lodge your point that is his worries some. Almost as worries some. The again in the mainstream media just a shorthand it seems to have been just missing the pinch hit us in the story you're being too generously so we know hey AB CNB idea that charitable disposition you do I believe. I believe in the best of the middle idea though they're constantly to some point they'll come here and I noticed by the quartet in every day honestly there's that -- was in My Fair Lady. AB CNBC she BS have not covered the story it cannot be because they missed it or somehow they don't understand it. The only explanation is that they are deliberately not covering it because they are part. The group that believes that there is global warming and and so fervent as their belief not only in the idea but also in the mission. They have an agenda that they won't. Produced contradictory information I. I have had conversations with a meteorologist in this market. And I won't use his name because I don't wanna get him fired -- told me point blank. That he was told by management as a meteorologist. On television to broadcast it. He is not too. Come up with anything contradictory. To the feces of global warming. He's jobless on the line I asked -- what about other meteorologists. In this market talk -- the Boston market and made up your television market. He said. The others are in the same same -- at -- don't know from minute getting them why then are -- have been -- -- have been coerced or intimidated into a position so we have a problem here with the scientific community there and corrupting its -- -- we -- for -- problem. With the media people who. Who professed. To be objective well committed to the people's right to know show and what it doesn't suit there agenda now that people can be kept in the dark. Yeah and speaking -- that -- -- people's right to know its attention to upon the observation that the caller made about. The mainstream media not covering this and whether it just so again bought into it for whatever reason economic or otherwise that the body into it. You know the whole notion of these set climate models that are gonna make these projections we were giggle and a little bit about politicians talking about forty and fifty plans for a sounds a little bit like the old Soviet Union and then -- together for one year plan to work but I stay -- -- 4050 atlas five he's -- climate models. In which we have difficulty really projecting what's gonna happen next Monday and Tuesday understandable -- that being critical of that but then how do you pretty hard how do you project with such precision. Do you project. Forty his -- -- -- real problem here for the climate that that the climate is warming up people is that over the last several years it's been cool has been going they -- explained that and that's what they've been -- -- somebody said one of these scientists say -- -- travesty that we can't explain -- substance is a travesty we want it would just -- the numbers and this one more travesty. So the dumping of the data. Was in response to word fear of a FOIA requests to talk about these -- the -- mainstream media. David Limbaugh and boy yeah right and usually it's a FOIA request from the globe The Herald huge -- you know one of those one of the stations. Made of the state house saw the White House talk congress and they gonna say look we want to see the data behind. In obese amid behind you know senator senator arriving Nelson's statement so FOIA request and everybody gets a little anxiety and had. Somebody somebody goes sort they would dumping this stuff that let's throw it out rather than reveal what I mean this is and now it's got this and this has all the elements of a nixonian. Cover up that if this was Richard Nixon. And a Watergate thing. You know the mainstream media is up and Arabs who -- you remember the history I remember him are all just thinking of George Bush -- it -- to oracle and oh that's a great point 6172666868. Let's go to Joan -- your audio and -- and Tom. Good morning gentlemen. I. One point I did Mario. Echo about the mainstream media not covering it I just I can't believe that that they would not. Think it was worth talking about what the other thing is -- Can't you call which aiding the results I think it's time to call for it is it flies and it's manipulation it's defeat all. And I think it's time for a tip -- miles thank you -- think that they're trying to beat. -- -- I I might have chosen its I I chose a -- a more diplomatic we're Joan I don't know. But primary and -- and -- a well yeah I I I like to think that have kind of generous but his the other thank the people on the side and the people that -- accuse -- of this this this horrific conduct. Said that a lot of the emails were about the inter elation of data and and tribulations data happens all the time no matter we you they go on and on any scientific debate. It would be how we gonna reconcile a would be. And so he can read it it you know if you're cynic you can read it and say hey look at the -- Did cheating did distorting it did trashing the data. Or you can say no that's a legitimate -- of scientific review so there may -- I'd I'd I'd be a little too diplomatic and I obviously David how he's given me just look here in the studio. -- -- -- -- -- what I guess I'm I think that's what got that they did so much trouble we all say. -- -- It would really do that but I'm beginning to find that people really don't don't they. Don't open my. I just start basing it. You know I Joe and I also wanna make the point here that the over the she's this -- kind of maverick behavior is extremely rare and scientific circles. Scientists take them from their mission very seriously. And you feel of a few road scientists should depart from what they should be doing. We should be careful lest we end up with a cynical view of the entire scientific scientific community because that's not the case. In this scandal having them were the -- exposed. And I I assure you that heads will roll and this will get cleaned out. The people who scientific community will not will not there will not put up with -- will not tolerate rightly so. You as well take a short break we see your calls and this is a great story was staying with that in with your calls will be back in a moment on AM 680 WRKO. Making Boston smarter -- At a time we are Boston's tall trees and KM six figure. W it's worth 46 degrees we have clear skies and Steve Douglas are three of veterans forms aren't so right now on -- six AB WRKO. Well currently -- I'm calling you know decade. Whenever it is. The main issue is. I would -- the global warming. We expect the question for -- I'm looking at he pool -- I -- and -- we'll have -- They don't feel -- now. Republican we are looking beautiful. That's the big the voice of yup David US senator there's Chevrolet Jeff bedroom -- senate late. I'm how -- Barbara Boxer. You know you talked earlier bodies it nixonian there is an -- and -- box area not plus we'll get -- to get the Democrats can do we do here. You notice from -- are Barbara black eyes he had no idea that's now all night I didn't want what I do you -- Obama noticed for her. It's let's not talk about what -- memos what the email say let's worry about the theft -- even their she's trying to deflect away from the important consideration just. We should find out if they were stolen then. You can I tell you can look at the fact. But what's important about these things the reason they've gotten current she knew that I talked about them is because the contents reveal. They corrupt and scientific process which is sabotaging. Our full understanding what's really going on with deployment and you do you think we could just say senator Nelson mail grandma I. -- -- outlawed that now that that's a quote our mobile live on a cocoa will live in infamy you wanna go he's told me your majesty of the fact is senator Barbara Barnes left. I'll look it of the front my original ship at least as a civilian. I really am a very interested in what dispassionate objective science would tell us what is going on. -- via a negative effect to our quality of life fought throughout to future generations from all the industrial activity associated with. You know mankind particularly over these past to have 200 years. -- and curious enough about it to one another truth. But I get become immensely frustrated when I sense that somebody has is plane -- get and I think this affair comets may it will go right to the calls I promised. For the environmental community this has become an article of faith. This is this substitute religion. It really is I -- -- either you don't have bunker formal religion and so this is this feels. In the alive and it is dissent is zealotry to a does -- fervor to rally that they'd say essentially. It doesn't matter what the impact is on our economy -- how does it matter what the impact is about quality of life of -- make it sound as if this is apocalyptic. And they surely have crushed under an iceberg all right heat wave -- -- -- -- have a Jesus the year Al Gore called guard Doug gonna be going. How can I shift from Barbara -- -- all right by -- just doesn't have that capacity let's go to -- hey -- welcome your -- -- obvious job. And I love your show because I'm really enjoying it then that aren't I want it known that. About 25 years ago my hasn't and I had contact with. The doctor Richard -- -- actually a professor at MIT. Yes and heat. He lamented. Way back 25 years ago that he was not able to get. Information -- by the way is the climate professor of whether professor at MIT -- And he was saying that he was not able to get is information. Published. It was squelched in not only that but he was saying that them that way that and that's and methods of collecting. Climate matter where. Faulty and it skewed toward climate warming. And. Yeah you're right Richard Lindsay and I -- him as a guest on my program and MIT any reminding me that the united we're Harvard together. -- -- and he knew he's made good and he has been you know for all that you say about how he. Wasn't. Wasn't allowed to publish or should you look he's a full professor at MIT. So he has been able to get. A fair amount of material published and he's one of the he's run of the skeptics one on one of the world's peoples gas -- up on the other guy but that doesn't address that story to tell us because this goes back you know. Do you know a couple of decades worth of pro professional crush -- Does the professor -- honored they haven't come to our wedding we just celebrated when he fourth wedding anniversary I'm sure that it's 25 years ago. -- that hey congratulations on that anniversary pat and thank you for the call -- on the other worrisome thing about this I think that's gone on up and cloud Copenhagen in this climate treaty. I wonder about the what we have to do to become we the United States of America to become signatories are parties to it. In what the retreat is what's the exit if in fact we find the science doesn't measure -- or the economic impact is unsustainable. You know we hit Kyoto and all the rest of that stuff my recollection is when Kyoto as a principal law Iraq. -- -- -- girl -- those -- -- -- was -- from a the United States -- I -- was voted -- -- by a -- of flight 98 and I think it did so so we might -- I try to wrap my mind around that say well I -- -- was like motherhood apple pie -- American -- everybody's in favor of it but then they put the -- -- front of the US senate which is made up -- -- you know balance of liberals and conservatives and other folks. And it went down 98 had let things soak in I don't wanna see the United States of America locked in to something. That commits us to an economic doomsday a result. Just to try to appease some environmentalist who is not. In two and even a semblance of an effort to find ballot. C -- the only good news here is that even though I don't trust Obama with called me and I don't think Obama should go I think he should use. This climate gave these these emails within the revelation that and the loss of their raw data as an excuse not to go. But if he does -- -- we don't shine on to this stuff because he's in the day immigration of America mode. At least the Senate will not ratified I don't anticipate there's going to be any accord coming out to cope and make it. And the main reason is that this that these with these other representatives of nations. Have an orientation that. Let's kick the United States around but it's okay for China and India who are developing economies. And who throw much more this garbage into the air -- the United States. The per per per capita. That think that it's okay for them to continue on they're not gonna sign onto any accord and without them signing on its foolish for the United States to cripple our own economy over. Those -- and there's an article in the news today that's as -- years and it is going to. Not proposed specific cuts for themselves so the way Australia was trying to do go to the Australian parliament. Voted down earlier this week and listen to this one does not hasn't even been touched upon yet in our conversation this morning have a the UN climate chief and others are calling for financial commitments to be made at Copenhagen from us the United States of America. -- billions of dollars in kind of up front money. The Third World countries to reimburse them listen to listen to what they say it's and deliver this is an an early draft of the treaty. That was supposed to make -- I have pay compensation. To Third World countries for quote lost opportunities. Resources and lives of land. And dignity it's reparations. For four right I suppose the colonial. Period of time. And the fact that these Third World nations is so far behind us well. Quite frankly idea I don't feel a sense of personal and national responsibility for the fact. That you know cut other countries around the world have not -- Yes so fortunate -- -- -- I'll go along with that but I also going to send them a bill for protecting them the from during world war to assure that they don't speak Japanese or German. And from the Russians in the during the Cold War they go to speak Russian. And and by the way I think we should children will pay out bail after they can do that I'm not only I guess you all tone. And all the medical technology and the food technology. And all things that the united this is my all those women I saw a lot of. I -- Chinese restaurant in Somerville say. We love waking up with -- to -- Wi -- -- the size about loudly they love you over there is still a -- -- -- get money from India and China demand on the let's go right to Dan hey Dan let's go on -- Hey -- comment thank you Robert proponents are probably goes deer hunting I didn't realize you aren't good. -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- Who did not. I don't do what you thought on this. Items are saying that you know when Jon Stewart on The Daily Show covers this story at least up a bit on the other night. And we see here in my mind it now -- more legitimate news source than they MSNBC. Got it it's interesting the funny part of the DN is the fact Jon Stewart did it. That's what will make it reverberate with the White House because it's the White House is a younger generation of the Twitter tweet FaceBook YouTube generation. And Stewart and the other people who provide that kind of -- the sarcastic. Commentary and now becoming more legitimate in the arise. When it's that's that hit that level and Jon Stewart. The White House to begin to pay attention to what. I hope very well and -- it's fair to me up under -- open debate it also heard that. He -- somewhere buried in what they're trying to do it it. Moving towards are restricting the citizen. Ownership of firearms are already in America -- all over the world. A -- I can only imagine the debate in the United States senate about blood you know John Kerry who went looking for hunting license in Ohio I -- yeah. -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- Well that morning Joe blow out but local. University of gold little female -- no. The local university. UMass Amherst Michael -- originally spotted this at UMass Amherst. Oh really I mean we see the real studies associated with Penn Station -- -- but I did know earlier in his career. -- UMass Amherst. Martha Coakley and you -- should be investigating them. Well that might happen -- and how about that quite. You if you go back to cooperate it would Al Gore. You're gonna have C beaten to read the 1200 dollars on climate gig came out he canceled. Yeah I saw that -- there was -- going to be a VIP reception 1200 bucks you could have a couple -- groups and -- might have your department now web you know UAE you wonder whether it's -- that these these big conferences however they need the gender is in the schedules constantly changing so who -- I don't wanna know what impugn his -- -- -- wanna wanna use Motorola. Yeah -- will. I -- a twelve plus and and I'm not talking and always talked about church and our -- and a that that she. You back. Where they'll wanna impugn pour out because that's right -- actor after all you know I think he lives in the in this enormous mansion and flies around in a private jet. Then winds and low carbon emissions and he wants to destabilize the latest -- billion you'll all want. Did you -- makeshift house climate you don't environmental we'd probably -- -- Hidden today it's amazing stuff somebody pointed out the other day the the great irony -- Goran climate -- getting poised on the the title of the Internet -- -- the thing he had been -- -- -- not a lot of Jon Stewart got a mentally okay. Hey Jim I appreciate the call 6172666860. Let's go to my K Mike welcome your -- -- your job. -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- But Torre would continue the boy was your status so like I don't Democrat naval. How hot off off off off you know that there. There are some of us that's a compliment up right at the end yeah trees and -- -- Leo about how I thought I -- venture include -- among a number of occasions on the -- fair. The only -- to become a Republican what do you think that's. The. They do currently you're becoming -- But they go thoughtful Democrat is how I prefer -- was described by so that's okay is not a not set out of any animosity to Republicans appreciate the call let's go to Steve hey Steve welcome your audio and -- -- Good morning guys just checked if you remember a couple of years back when that intellectual lightweight Matt -- traveled all over the world other global warming -- today -- doctor -- Arctic they will live with the polar -- you Democrats. Well is it yeah we is that they do brother tennis yeah. It was the global warming hot spot and then NBC shut their lights off. To be green at some point I bet they do it every year I mean it it opened a ridiculous that's by the -- cricket -- pick the -- look as stupid as they really are that's the reason they're not covered in. -- probably right and I must say that then in fairness we all are reluctant. Did to do things their cars ourselves embarrassment we always staked out a claymore made an argument pounded the desk. And then it turns out that thing into Iran -- should -- you asked -- not easy to do but now that sent a million to twenty to understand it's going to condone. If your in the news business. You all the people having a straight shot into residues hey you know here's how I think the American people respond to either an organization let's say NBC CBS ABC. Or an individual.