Oct 21, 2016|
10/20/2016 - Beyond Reality Radio with Jason Hawes & JV Johnson - guest Dr. Robert Bartholomew discusses his books regarding Bigfoot and mass hysteria. Dr. Bartholomew's research of sightings throughout New York State, and New England answer some questions and raise others. Could mass hysteria be involved, or will we some day find irrefutable evidence that the creatures exist. Also, we discuss the creepy clown craze, and it's seemingly increasing menace. Plus, listener phone calls.
Transcript - Not for consumer use. Robot overlords only. Will not be accurate.
This episode of beyond reality radio was recorded October 20 2016. So I'm all confused. It was the Walking Dead kickoff this last Sunday airs next Sunday airs this coming from you know third and op idea I was a little nervous because some I really wanted to see in a much we did it just happened I can't please keep keep these weeks straight welcome to be a three equity radio everywhere and everybody else they're welcome to be unreality radio Jason NGV. We got a great show tonight Doug doctor Robert Bartholomew. And I he's written extensively and UFO's poltergeist assaults social panic mass hysteria. Tabloid journalism is also written a vote of three books on crypto zoology including history bigfoot sightings in new York New England. And Lake Champlain monster but also something new is added to this right at Jim. Yeah busy also has written a book chapter on phantom clowns. And yet so phantom clay especially with all this craziness of it concentrated that's going arm. Yeah he's another prolific writer our guest last night's Williams Stillman wrote about a bunch different topics we covered a few of them and doctor Robert Bartholomew is another one of those types are writer he's got a lot of areas of expertise. And it all kind of an inner sex around the topics that we discuss are gonna wander good things to ask him. Particularly owner bring up because of his work on mass hysteria wanna talk to about does Salem witch trials and get his take. On that we talked about that whether guest earlier in the week whether it was mass hysteria there were some other causes that related to that. Yes definitely and that's a neat topic to bring up it actually comes on the whole sailing Salem witch trials. But Tom and we've got to buy a bunch agree shows lined up for next week we're going to be talking model different things we're gonna have. And gentlemen on William key and then next week at some point he's an expert Christopher Columbus. And Wall Street discussing and talking about Christopher Columbus supposedly did not discover America. Which I'm a believer that he didn't because the in this proof that the vikings are here prior. And they you know it's pretty admirable let alone I believe the native Americans is actually discovered America we just yes said hey we've got a flag won't put that here and there. Knight country. I think you know most of us grew up in in school we learned Christopher Columbus discovered America and I think that it's been pretty well disproven. And pretty well accepted that there were some nordic. Adventurers that came across. Up and into Nova Scotia and down in that area we don't know how far in when they made it. There's some evidence that they made it quite far actually. We're talking about X was a Minnesota or Wisconsin somewhere they were fine. Now in Minnesota they found rocks and really had a car region dorm from psychics but. You know it's tough to would have been I I understand why history chain to the round because how tough it would have been to write a song about the vikings is gonna win especially against something like Columbus Columbus sailed the ocean blue and 14192. There like. Yeah we can arrange something with the vikings so let's just stick with corn vikings should my kings he does yeah I mean it doesn't work whatever itself but on what. Think that that Columbus did do that maybe the vikings didn't do is you know they actually. Created trading routes that that you know brought in most of Western Europe at the time and you know that's why I guess he was credited though with the discovery vs the vikings who kind of just visit didn't last they didn't really set colony user. Threaded it have a very popular they aren't meant to transfer going places killing that's true they were urging all of stop. So it to have it really didn't. I think if they claim they were out here I'm immediately killed along and then there's nowhere near the village no villages to pillage they left. It's Leo that's going to be a great conversation and it's a it's a bit controversial but I think that history starting to revise itself and realize that. It wasn't Columbus that was here representing Europe first. It Jim you know what happened on this thing you know all throw not actually today we book I mean other than national bigfoot then. You know. Yes there's there's things happened really Tokyo and also happen well first off congress on Wednesday congress investigates. Reds in Hollywood and I'll probably remember that whole red scare kick where. You know I don't know these people or Communists and the committee for un American activities or something like that comes McCarthyism is what it's better known as and in fact. Our guest talking about the Salem with witch trials you know witch hunts quote unquote. Heaven ended in fact that's cited as kind of contemporary witch hunt. Has an even more important that. In 1990 mister two crew members were acquitted of sin that is that's a major day remembers just had a group or so and and I used to have that nice to have it sent yeah so is set. In when it meets. On the analysts let me upgrade. But. Come through members of the rap group two live crew over acquitted there were acquitted obscenity charges of four. A lot of dough Florida Luther Campbell could Chris. Long long and Mark Ross. At face a year in prison for proof performing their songs which were considered to be sexually yeah. Six we have seen which. We all gone there were sexually deceit and there's no hits into today's standards of government and even there yet today this is that's just natural pop the plea is on on the local radio station funny how far we've changed and now joins us. But he SO. It is so a lot of lot of neat things in history throughout the days 9044 national gas explosion rocked Cleveland. On yes and 904194. Before MacArthur returns. Now he said he was gonna do that he says there shall return 73 Sydney Opera House opens. Most goes on I can be your money or just a walking in early age and is excited 1994 on Tuesday. You know lead. It's a well. Are you a little unfair I'm thinking of Kirk douglas' and he still alive easily turn and actually I saw I saw him an idea that I wildness in him when I was in Hollywood. One who went down. And a met up with some some friends and yeah he leaves at the same restaurants us. Not school then sees it but it's almost a hundred years ultimately that's pretty cool I'm 19773. Members of the southern rock there Leonard Skinner. That was a tragic day for music people needn't opening line you think of the market you'll be lost you lost Jim Croce to a to a plane crash. You Austin John Denver. John and number Vietnam. Or you lost every new roads for Ozzie Osborne's first then she spent most of Sama. We have to do a program where we bring somebody in a medium or something try to we try to contact some of these Iraq and religions. That actually sells donated so. The temperature might be talking about policy especially pretty medium and to connect to somebody so I was that. I was on stage in buffalo on Tuesday he was Steve. And a very nicely came over and started talking to me about these experiences she had to say guns trying to connect with Houdini. And I and a line of people that China mean take pictures with so I said door as you know lot. It's my friend Jimmy is a very big fan of everything who genius and so you really need to go talk to him. And tell him about this now this was pretty much in the first five minutes of me doing a meet and greet meeting everybody. And an hour and a half later. Steve looks to me goes. At least still targeted Jim could put any stock in the corner so it was the funniest thing in the world to me by and not not use him by. To me I was listening intently but that was a long conversation there was a prepared to have. You know where you're with it for about the first three minutes you can then you're kind of just looking off at all we're directions I was looking for an escape Purdue wasn't one readily available it was kind of stuck by. It was interesting nonetheless take did you hear this Kemper counting I don't know where Kemper county uses because it doesn't say here in this this news article. Now maybe somebody listening knows and can and can let us know but Kemper is Kemper county. The board of he blew the supervisors unanimously approved an ordinance during its regular meeting on Monday last Monday that it makes it unlawful for any person of any age to appear in public in Kemper county in a clown costume clown mask. Or clown makeup. Are you serious so in other words they're pretty much saying that you cannot address is a clown for following. That's basically it now might question do you is I've seen some some ladies that Wear a lot of make up. Is that considered you know like that if they are the zero line somewhere where most of them look more like I'm my name comes up if the so and but I just don't understand how they can tell you cannot Wear a costume. On a high note and it seems like there's a whole bunch of free speech issues there there's a whole bunch of stuff going on the ACLU would be on top of that they got more they get. They yet of the things are worried about defending terrorists and stuff the ordinance is enforceable from starting this coming Monday through the day after Halloween so they're only gonna do it temporarily through Halloween. Superman icons for one we I think they're clowns of America should all unite and vote. The home they had that clown minds now at a rally that got canceled because of death threats Roseanne and Arizona. Yeah we did talk unilateral give ups that would mean for column that in the I'm and I am not a Vanilla. So. But there's honestly there's people out there and I hate to admit it but he you can look it up but his people out there who actually have had their faces tattooed permanently. With classic from the as a clown actually won one shown up on America's Got Talent. And he did didn't last long and what's and what's Kemper county unit Juba that exactly so I mean. Well now. Who achieves even stranger Jim if you heard about the flesh eating screw worms that are beating the US hated this. We're fallen apart from every direction we are totally screwed we guess what it's doing on the what's gonna coincidentally and of the new world to screw worms in the Florida Keys is. His. Possibly spreading north. The keys are facing the country's first screw worm infestation. Pamela requirement throw there since the 1960s. Now Jim these things are gross. Tonight there really nothing remains close and Alia destroy or it's a mag get of the blah lovable fleiss. It seeks out a warned of an injured warm blooded animal. The latest alarm fire in the alarm life feeds on the animals living flesh until they become. Pew poll book. And dropped to the ground and emerges adult flies. So what does it do to the hostess does the animals can do is some animals actually died from a room. But you know some some wounds can contain hundreds of these did you say they were in Florida. Yes or OK so Florida now has these screw worms they've got this eco mosquitos. The he's an accord encephalitis. You know that was one of the states on my list in my hamsters have to think about that again. What that is going on Florida it's just that's are you wanna systems boot you look up those the storms because my guys. It just terrified market nervously a bad site by Saturday night move. Screw word Reggie dolls were on Tuesday night at all senator and I movies on site fire bad but that's just horrible that is horrible. Our itself with bullets that are so we'll take a break away and we come back we'll have doctor Robert Bartholomew. On with the SOA illicit Jason. You be on the unreality real effect. Thanks Eric Kahn might be over for this year but there's another scare economy works you owe it to yourself to check out the details go to scary time dot com that's Garrick con. Dot com sign up for the email list and be informed you need to know what's going on with scary con because it's the best weekend of the year scare coming clean celebrities fans. Vendors parties panel discussions film premieres and so much more it's a weekend you'll never forget if everyone is welcome visit the website scary kind dot com that's scary con dot com and. Hope to be on reality Randy you know screw worms here this is all good stuff. On the airwaves tonight thanks for being in the chat room with a list. Thank you for listening on it on your local radio stations later in the program we'll take phone calls and numbers 8446877669. And a quick reminder. To stop by the face a page give delay can also stop by the web page if you wanna join the chat room. Absolutely check it out FaceBook dot com slash beyond reality real like the FaceBook page and then swing on over to be on reality radio and join that in July chat with. All the great people that announcement that nine in the listening to us and communicating back and forth. Aaron let's go to our guest line and bring in our guest actor Robert prof Bartholomew. Doctor Robert thanks so much for joining us some beyond reality radio tonight. I think you have to tell you all I'm doing this from my bed. Because I have the flu broke well I'll I am. Given an adult here and I'm on antibiotics are just starting to heal that better. You my friend are a trooper and we and greatly appreciate admire him man and we greatly appreciate coming on especially being sick like that. Yeah I don't want to jinx myself but that's been my fear as the cold and flu season has started to approach have to do this radio show while sick because that's no fun. You know the odd thing is. My wife doesn't watch your diet doesn't exercise is not an end. Didn't get sick I exercise I watch my diet carefully and and I got us. But isn't that the wave and the whole world goes I mean that healthy people are always at the gym usually die young and the people don't take care of themselves Serbs and bleeding the health care system dry because they last forever. Now I'll. So click public to the book there somewhere in speaking of books. Rubber you've done a tremendous amount writing and in many many topics tonight we're gonna spend a little time talking about. Crypt it's particularly big foot now it's national bigfoot date Jason I've been trying to gain get to the bottom. Of who declared this national bid for a day when I say. That debt is it was the twentieth of October even though we've kind of lapsed over into the 21 here you have any idea who declared this national bigfoot day. I I don't have a clue at the but I guess we'll go with a right and someone did somewhere civil. We'll go to. So one of the books. Well I think giver and a couple books actually about to big foot. Sightings legends discussions. Upstate New York from monster I believe. Basically. Adirondack kinda area I guess thome thome where. The the the what's the geography that you covered written in these particular books and let's talk a little bit about what's what the legends in the stories are. Sure problem we started out it's. When the book in the early 1990s. Which is kind of a whole book now called monsters of the north woods. And that was on bigfoot sightings in New York in Vermont mainly upstate New York western new York and in the state of Vermont. And that book sold over 101000 copies went through two printings and is now autumn prints. And so what my brother and I did we. Put out another book in 20082009. Called big tournament owners in new York and new England's. And we looked at the entire. Region. Are in the history of sightings are in that region. Carrot and New England so. CA expanded often Vermont things are you're covering Vermont. New Hampshire Massachusetts are allowing Connecticut. Yet this thing literally happened in our back yard. We grew up on a farm in upstate New York in a community called White Hall. And there were bigfoot sightings all around our armed not on our farm in the nearby farming. Autumn farms and in the woods. And that's how we got involved with us starting to investigate these cases. Now in Whitehall you do what was it properly popularly known as the white home monster. No you know it some. It really never was known as anything. Norris some big sightings in the mid 1970s. Was just called big four. I'm trying to yeah I'm trying to remember we we've had a discussion about a white home monster I thought it was an irishman who wasn't white home in New York we are talking about at the time knowing no there there. Was we we've had discussions with people in the past we're talking about that they referred to as the White Hall monster in an upstate New York by the but now maybe it's just too different aren't totally two different creatures. Well like I think it's the same creature or what's happened is with the Outdoor Life Network document Jerry. And a couple of other documents series it kind of got hold the White Hall monster creature Whitehall. But that never was referred to that up until about 2000. Just all the big four. So when you chose that geography because that was home TU. That's right and our neighbor who was a farmer that my father went to school where his name was what sparks. Got rid of his columns. And opened up well odd nine hole golf course. And that went on for yours and yours is still going today. And my father came home one night he said Janelle almost talking to close beneath you saw this bigfoot creature you'll never say anything to you. And bought my what my father grew up with him in my family has lived the air since the mid sixteen hundreds. Of salt. I went I went over the air one day and exit so class I said duck we're doing a book on unusual animal sightings I didn't use the word before. I said which would you mind describing what you saw in he did that we didn't know cleft in my father didn't know him. Swore. His entire life we never would have got that side and he never would have said anything. But you're indeed cliffs see this creature multiple times or was there one time cited. It was a one time siding he went out to I think it was the first green. But 103011 o'clock at night it was water in the green and he said he saw this huge. Ball. Six and a half seven foot tall creature. That went crashing through the wards as little wooded area there and here's the thing. I'm a skeptic I'm a sympathetic skeptic I need to dead alien in front of me I need the body of bigfoot. On. I grew up in White Hall that sparks. Doesn't line. I grew up in White Hall in two police officers who I went to school where. Swore they saw this walk in front of their car in the middle of winter near south bay. And they were just stunned. They were line that's one thing I know these people are line I'm not saying it is a creature. While there are not lying. And I I and we can talk about what possibly could be and it's up it's a fascinating phenomenon. That people need to take seriously. In the vast majority of people I'm assigned either Ph.D. medical sociology. At towels say this. The vast majority of people that my brother Paul Bartholomew and I have talked to. Are not hoax. Or not lying their honest sincere people. Are credible people reporting incredible stories. So in the in the process of assembling these stories and talking to these people to write the two books. Of about how many encounters did you look into. A couple of hundred. Blundered and owners going back to Indian times. And here's the thing. Army. Whatever is going on in the northwest excuse me. Whatever is going on in the Pacific northwest. It's that same phenomenon. And that's the conundrum. On the one eons or no fossils. Or no bones there's nobody. There's no DNA evidence. Despite their being around 330 million Americans. Millions of whom are hotter since our the wards with guns every year. On the other hands. Is a long history in New York for my in New England. Of seeing eight. Paul hairy ape like creature about seven feet tall. Owing back to the time of the native Americans in the early settlers. The early format settlers. Hold of this beer. That ran around on two legs that they referred to as slippery skin. There were is that there were a number of stories of people claiming to see this here now in. I recently. In New Jersey you had a beer can was paddles the beer. Yen after all that's great. Yeah mine light Harrell who do we got to take a break but when we come back with so let's get into a little more of you listen to Jason JB MB unreality. Revealed right back out. Welcome back beyond reality radio taste causing JB Johnson is national big foot day and we are talking with doctor Robert Bartholomew. Who is a medical sociologist written extensively on UFOs poltergeist social panics mass hysteria as. And the history of tabloid journalism also written three books on crypto zoology including the history of bigfoot sightings in new York and new England and on the Lake Champlain monsters all also written a book chapter on phantom clowns and we're definitely going to be bringing that topic up a little bit later in our conversation because. This clown thing has just gotten out of hand but back to the big foot discussion. Robert you had mentioned that in your discussions with folks who have had encounters. By and large these aren't hoax or is these are genuine people who really really saw an experience something in some cases it probably frighten them significantly. On as a skeptic. And I think Jason and I take the same position your were were were skeptical. We wanna believe we will but we need to see little more evidence before we can definitively believe. But as a skeptic when you talk to these people you get the sense that they actually saw what they saw. Or what they're saying they saw or do you think they were misinterpreting something else. The most part you know. What I'm all they are and it's 2 o'clock that morning in your interview witnesses like. They saw bigfoot. And it says it's a real conundrum. In opus the skeptics. And I have a problem would dogmatic skeptics mean I'm a well known skeptic writer I've written a lot of articles skeptic journals. What are some skeptics can be sold dogmatic. I'm just like some true believers. And you know to. It's it's difficult sometimes to go down the middle of the road because you can get hit by both sides but. Some skeptics argue that a lot of these people are pranksters boxers. On and it's just not the case. All they're ordinary people counting extraordinary. Events many of them in white all of that region. Our police officers. Are conservation officers. She jurors. Are we'd interviewed principles. They're certainly not making this up and there's certainly something. Going on the other thing that's interesting is you have these trails a huge footprints. Founded in the middle of nowhere. Why would someone go to such lengths not knowing if anyone would visit the area for months or years. Another reference could be obliterated in a matter of minutes if it rains or she Knowles are gusting wind comes up it doesn't make sense. Well but on the same note and I I do agree with you especially with the skeptic side every I think everybody needs to be skeptic but you need to. At least be willing to look at all possibilities when it comes down to it not. No and not. Where some stand with the whole. No matter what a ghost could walk right by them and it didn't happen and and so forth so I do agree with you on that but also in that same. In this same discussion you're talking about how I hunters in the woods and yeah like my my brother he's he's a hunter and he'll set up a tree stand sit in the woods in for six hours. And dead silent sitting up there now with all these hunters going in and these guys who are known for being able to track. Why have they might have been unable to get hard core evidence. And that they can put out there in the real world to to support these experiences or. That that a bigfoot does actually exist. It's a really good point a lot of big fellow researchers today. We'll leave that soft flesh and blood creature. And what it somehow managed to elude capture. I actually think that that's the least likely explanation. Mean if it's true it's a flesh and blood creature. It has to have some kind of very specialized. Evolutionary mechanism. That allows it to elude capture for example. A chameleon. Changes color to blend them with the surroundings. And become seemingly invisible. Problem the peregrine falcon. Has remarkable eyesight can spot intervals up to five miles away. Rob owls have developed amazing night vision. So I I think all likelihood that you have a flesh and blood creature. Like a bear or any other animal. On yes it's possible. But I don't think it's very likely I think the facts speak for themselves you you chance. The arise with what you hope is is. Happening out there you have to look at the facts and let the facts dry eight. The Reese searched yet. And when you and when you're talking about a million and so forth you're talking about thousands of years of evolution to. To be able to eat all evolves into a species that can survive in its territory so. And I understand where you're sane and bigfoot or maybe over the thousands of years the devolve to the ability of being able to blend into their environment incredibly. Play it but in this say it's just it's one of those things where late Jimmy who sank. I wanna believe but there's no we we all spend so much time in the woods and so forth and how anything cute he could have you need. Being seen or. Or anything like that for so long what's with such a huge population not that they have totally paid because there are people out there that experiences. But I mean just being able to evade for so long. It's just it seems so far out there from me and I'm I guess I'm one of those guys who I want to believe. And I'm a firm believer that things exist far beyond what what we've been able to fine but it. It's just that's just a question I'm always had is why haven't we been able to at least. Get solid proof father. You know I think that's a great attitude that you have there and often times people in your line of work get maligned. For being just like true believers and they able everything. Is a goal store every rustling in the in the bush chooses a big foot. Every light in the sky is a UF ON. Dot. It's great to have that attitude I mean. As are all in speculative. As it sounds. I think immoral the paranormal hypothesis is more likely. But I don't know what that is I mean it's important to emphasize. You can't get ahead of yourself Jeff looked at actually Jews for example. If there is a seemingly bizarre reports. You can't exclude it and a recorded. You need to record everything. In looks for patterns and what. Interesting to me. Starting in the 1970s. Were the books by Jerome Clark and Lauren Coleman the unidentified in creatures the out dredged X. They started documenting these cases. All of people seeing big foot and they said it it disappeared. In a flash of light like someone taking a picture or they can actually see through. And I think these reports. They're not that common but they occur. I think they probably occur a lot before as well people just ignore say all persons crazy or. I am just not right that down that you you've got to. Write everything down in and look for patterns. And who knows what you know another dimension is. It's just something that's not here I mean there are cases upstate new York and Verona. What people see the footprints. And they go well. Into the wards or they go all into a year olds and they just stop. And I don't know maybe the ground harder. I don't know but I cannot accept that it's a flesh and blood creature I just. I think we're we're so many people all the year throughout the entire history of the world. You would've gotten a body. You would have found fossils you would have found bones by now and it just hasn't happened so you have to have to look elsewhere. And were elsewhere or should we be looking. All of a sociologist. And the hypothesis. I would subscribed to it is a Psycho social hypothesis. Combination of psychology. Sociology and folklore I mean look. A problem. As a scientist. This is the hypothesis that you have to go. Until there is some conclusive evidence to the contrary. Most big foot imperil more researchers are not familiar with the research on perceptual psychology. Mean human perception is very unreliable and subject here. It's especially cell. With paranormal phenomenon. Because people have such a vested interest because they want to believe. And some other phenomena are reported to be interpreted as forms of life after death. How can thousands of people. Will report seeing big foot every year you wrong. Mean how is it possible for masses of people. To not only believe in the existence of something. Also report seeing. In the description is remarkably similar. So I'm seeing these things that don't mesh. Well let me give you an example. The example is in 1938. You have the war of the worlds radio is here where. Orson Welles. Producer. Took the book by HG wells for the world's admitted into radio play any claim martians. We're invading our. And they claim that the martians were firing he rates. A bomb claim that there was poison gas. And people actually call the police coughing. Said they could smell the poison gas. People said he could feel the heat race there were stuffing. Ought to issues anchor chiefs underneath their doors are there key holes. Stop the gas from getting in other wasn't any poison gas so how can so many people. Report something. That didn't happen so you have to be careful. As Carl Sagan said. Wherever we have strong emotions. We're liable to fool ourselves. Note not every light in the sky is an alien spaceship. I'm not every wage. On a lake is a prehistoric what that's like creature. And not every noise or spike in geo magnetic activity in a building. Is a haunting. So we we have to be careful especially. Because so many people as you said an ice I'd say myself I wanna believe. I wanna believe because I hope that when I die. I hope I don't die doing this interview Arab excuse me. I want to believe that there's more to life then fade to black. I would hope that there's some kind of spirit world while there but I need evidence. Bright yet we're talking with doctor Robert Bartholomew we're talking it's national bid for days we're talking about big thoughts and when we come back from our break I wanna find out. What the population of the puts is in New York State did the specifically because that's the area that. That a doctor Robert actually it's been what time investigating. But then we can kind of extrapolate that number and she woke you know what. How many of them are out there. And in it isn't enough to be caught in and is it enough to get the kind of evidence that were talking about because maybe it's simply a population issue so we're talking big for its. It's beyond reality radio. Jason Teague. Hey gang at JP from beyond reality radio reminding you that taps parent magazine is the official publication of the tax organization. That's right if you're interested. You need to subscribe taps her match. Now's your chance to do it at a special rate and the best news is it taps her magazine has been completely redesign and re launched to serve you. That's right go to the website its taps her bag dot com that's tap experiment dot com. Click on the subscribe now by enter the promo code beyond at checkout and save even more on your subscription it's at her. Where every issue was filled with the latest information regarding the kernel community whether it's TV weather radio or whether it's happening in your neighborhood it. Error magazine again go to the website tab CarMax dot com. That's caps CarMax dot com use promo code beyond just say. Are welcome back to pay hourly L radio Jason Hawes Stevie Johnson it is Thursday nights are less broadcast night of the week by the way. Monday night will be rejoining you of course and we will have found it's Jim Harold money and ran into talking about his paranormal podcasts and all the people he's interviewed over. Past ten years and have shown absolutely and then Tuesday will have a chorus and not turn them these. Are we talking now about a bunch of different things but one of the things we're going to be referring to also is. Involvement in the church of Satan and and we like to hear all sides of everybody's beliefs and and so forth yourself. And after that we've got William key key and he's an expert Christopher Columbus. We're going to be talking about the history and now. A lot of it actually looks like it's wrong and Thursday we've got a somebody a friend of ours we had on quite a while ago with the show dark water it was great. Are phenomenal and the he's gonna discuss some of the previous stories is out of New Orleans and and we are down there on a couple channels and owns and he's just he's wonderful have on I think you'll really get a kick for. Yeah what he does he he he researchers real life paranormal encounters. And then he puts them into a dramatic form and retell the story with some actors voice actors and stuff like that makes a really creep please what a demo like Pearson Allison because obvious it is that it's spooky. It was a it was great we do know what to expect when we had him on the first time it was really really a lot of fun. On tonight's guest is doctor Robert birth column know we are talking about big footed as national bigfoot day. And we are gonna continue the conversation just a moment I wanna remind folks that the telephone numbers 844. 6877669. If you've been waiting on hold please continue to weigh we're gonna bring calls in just a little bit. Robert again thanks so much for joining us on the program. We were talking about this lack of evidence which is the major you know it's it's it's the it's and it's it's our million dollar question if you all. And the the fact that. We've got hunters out in the woods who got a population of 330 million people in the United States more eyes than ever before we've got trail cameras set up all over the place everybody's carrying a cell phone with great video. And photographic capabilities yet we can't yet. A clear image of one of these now. One of the things that people hypothesize. And those who were looking to explain away the fact we can't get evidence is that. Eight there're there are species that were still discovering all the time that are on earth that we haven't known existed in our in our entire history and meet you were talking about a multi dimensional creatures some a creature that folks in and out of our reality your dimension in their four. We only get these brief glimpses and never have enough time to actually get a serious photograph or video. Well and even beyond that there's also the other people who this new claim it's been out there for awhile some people talk about how. They believe that there sort of the the people in the creatures that. Aliens drop off on the planet to exploring and bring them back and gather their information from them so there's a lot of different theories on the yet any of those ring true do you. Well I'd I'd he's the evidence. The interesting thing is that big what is reported all over the world I'm here in New Zealand. We have the core handled Meehan. The Korean Peninsula. It's seen in Indonesia. I just saw recent YouTube clip on some. Fuzzy black. Creature in the distance walking that supposedly big slut. It's seen in Russia seen in China. Seen in almost all the fifty states. It's seen in Australia. So it's not just a few sporadic sightings. And a handful of remote areas. Year end in a year how big foot is consistently reported. All over the world yet. We don't have that body you don't have the fossils we don't have the bones so that's why I say just thinking out loud. May be the bigfoot mystery is like an idiots. Trying to comprehend don't riding lawnmower. It's so far beyond our understanding of 21 century science. Like it like decade me and seeing the northern lights or look at Stalin's falling from the sky up until the early eighteen hundreds. People around the world. Claimed to see stones fall from the sky are thought to be seeing optical illusions. No. They are called meteors. Arm look at bacteria with old servers it was thought that altars were caused by stress. And this doctor and Australia that. Got the Nobel Prize for this he actually gave himself an old Serb why I think he swallow chlamydia or something. Bacteria. And then he showed this thing down his throat took pictures before and after Ernie used himself as a Guinea pig but he was labeled as a quack initially. So you don't sit as you were saying it's important to keep an open mind. So when we look at these theories and we look at these ideas. I'm sometimes it's presented to us that this highly intelligent SaaS watch creature this bigfoot creature. On is just being elusive. But it it seems as though would that kind of intelligence it was the kind of intelligence that some of the researchers claim this. Bigfoot creature has it seems as though they would want to make contact they want to have some type of an erection even if it was just to say leave us alone. Yeah iron. That that's the interesting thing I've studied this since I was like nine years old. And I'm 58 now and when you look at the case after case when you look at John Green book. When you look at the Coleman and Clark books and all the different books on on a big for what you find is. Or number of cases work. Bigfoot. Charms and looks at somebody. And it's just they remarked that it was. It like Sharon look it's is that you're not as if you're not even there. There's a chase that we investigated near Tinder hook New York in the 1980s. Or woman named Margaret mayor. She said she was driving down the road this dark country road near under look and she saw this creature. Liked flow across the road in front of her was like. Bigfoot have marshmallow man. Ed Rosa the cases. You have to know we got a detailed interview with her reported in the book. Most of the cases you have to write down. And when it comes to UFO is jail and a fine. Used to say. He was most interested in the high strangeness cases. Because if someone was gonna hoax. Are more likely to hoax book what's the stereotypical. Report all I saw bigfoot it was seven foot tall and area while global. When you see things that other people are reporting. In your short that it happens. Those I think are important clues potential clues. To write down and then you start comparing notes. Robber we had a a caller and we're gonna have to go to break for we're gonna get it could be if you have an opportunity for me to answer this. But think about it during the break we had a caller from the buffalo area of New York Western New York. Who has been living in fear. After having an encounter I don't remember when it was Jay was a few years back where she said she was walking by is streaming she looked over and there was this creature that at first she thought infection called thinking it was a big foot type creature but then she started just described its face. And it. Sounds more like a dog man type creature so think about that I wanna talk about any to any connection between big foot in dog man and if you encountered. Any stories about the dog men and up. Upstate New York during your research it's beyond reality radio I'm Jason team. Welcome back. It's. We've been talking with the doctor Robert Bartholomew about the big flats and through New York through new England and just so much more and and movement into the Newton really are they in our realm and on our Rome. Just so many questions out there. Yet doctor Robert is the author of monsters of the north woods and bigfoot encounters in New York. And New England has had a lot of experience talking to folks who have. Claimed to have had sightings are encounters. We bigfoot throughout the did in New England in New York regions and you know before we went to break. We brought up the question of the dog man because. There seems to be a lot of fun. Common features of those two creatures according to people who seem them there is a difference in the face. And a Robert did you read in your discussions with folks come across anyone. Or anybody who had what would be considered a dog man citing verses of bigfoot sighting. No I haven't on that reminds me of the chase in Toledo Ohio in the 1970s. Where. There were multiple sightings of the dog like creature. All walking around on sore legs yet had like a human like face. Com. That's Democrat knows heard. Yeah it would it was pretty bizarre you know it was out it was from a major newspaper at the time. I got that's what those newspaper clipping service is as a kid. Bob what's interesting is you get different crypt kids. In different parts of the United States. In in different parts of the world. And you get different traditions. So like as well as a psychologist might say. OK well there's a certain tradition here of belief that there's some kind of bought preached chair well when somebody's out at night Nate you're wrestling at Bush's. They missed identify something as a dog autumn. On the other hands. On it that would be the psychological explanation. Bob what's interesting is though are people like John Kiel might argue. That these there are window areas or flat areas. What people seat persistently certain types of Arctic creatures. And so the question is from a folklore is a folklore some say are all this identification. Pre stereotyping. Preconceived idea. When someone like John Q say maybe it's a window area a slap area. Well and a lot of the reports of dog man are actually it's standing up on Q2. Legs and have has like you who have type. Feed him and its legs Benton about a 45 degree angle. And yet so there's so will you just where you're just talking about him being down on four legs and having a human type phase. I hear the Gaza street I haven't heard that that person that's ever preach about vessel and terrifies a lot of. All ultra fine. In the are always center. I have solidity great thank you are without a listener who's been on the phone for quite some time has a question for. Robert let's bring Nina from California into the program welcome to be on reality radio. I gave and thank you so much for having me ask Robert gas I have a quick question. It's about bigfoot of course but it's special to protect this and I was wondering since there have been actually cried Peter rumors. Where I live in California in a lot me and focused area. Pretty exciting and actually there have been. A few who also document lined out and Fred though cattle. I just I just wanted to know your cake exactly on that and if you knew any further evidence in it or not. You know that's the really interesting thing about this phenomenal. It when people don't know much about bigfoot this Yale law people are just this identifying herself like I'm okay I'm sure that consent to a to a certain extent. But that I I say to myself I mean. This this isn't a few isolated cases in one region. And then another region. You're talking thousands of sightings every year mean this is a massive phenomenon people though some people don't realize the scope of this. And so that's why I say. You know there's there's something going on here. I don't fully understand it. All I don't think it's a flesh and blood preacher because I think we would have won by now. Well there's something going on and I think it's OK to say. I don't fully understand it but we need to. Understand that we need to collect the cases. In just report exactly as people described at the time. Or whether our phase of the moon. Everything. Needed did you say you had an encounter yourself. I haven't. Other people I had I have known. To have those. Claimed it has. Have seen it I can and and I have also heard it appears that. Some lion. Shot it one time and and what they perceived is this really large sort it carries seven to eight foot tall animal. And it was it was on two legs and well they shot and then AE brand away and there was no. Evidence of it really even being there. No blood or anything now it's been strange to me hey thanks for the call thanks for sharing that within easy for the cold in. Much. So as I mean let me be the first. Report I've heard it and robbery you may have more stories of of somebody actually thinking may. They shot one of these creatures in and next wounded I have heard of reports of people claiming that they shop easings and that they just these things kept moving. It's been hit by cars is been shot. If you look at our gen Colin board's case sparked if you look at John cream greens great book also ask what's the apes among us. All were and number of reports like that Internet super common their common enough the interesting point I'll make his. A lot of people who haven't Connors. Were big book. Say that they experiences changed them in some way I did become more spiritual. I mean you see that with with you awful close encounter reports. From bound personality changes. Suddenly become more spiritual. And you see that sometimes with boasting counters as well. On and look you benefits entirely psychological and I'm not saying it is. For this reason alone. It's important to understand what's exactly going on here. There and. And also just a fact that your brain. And when you see something like that of course even if you wanna believe your brain a lot of times are ghosts and everything else is telling you that it's not real. So when you have these experiences. I would think it is sort of opens up that part of the brain and and says the see it it is possible. So it does make you more open and aware tuned to the possibility of these things. Well there's a biologist. Who's come up with a theory. That might be something in our brain because evolutionary biology. That you know back in the cave person type things. We. Restart lives every time we saw in the animal. We wanted to know whether it's render all snakes. Big that's why people to creeped out because snakes. And that there might be some. Evolutionary biological mechanism in our brains. In dark environments. It triggers off. Sightings hairy creatures. On which would explain why you never find a body fossils and bones yeah people claim to see it. However wouldn't explain the trail of footprints going all into a well paddock or a a few old and then suddenly stops. Right but some let's go to the phone lines again we have thought mark from Kansas on the phone mark welcome to be on reality radio. These gentlemen thank you as I'm sorry utterly at caught didn't get a little too weak opening. An introduction have we get. And it's seems like work out and more like it but apparently. So here it. Implications are a mess. People are out papers see. And I think dislike. Well any number of different regional. You guys talked about electorate about each area against our target of utter wreck each six action. Country people. A mystery something that they wished to have it's like get a little excitement. The regional and yeah they're they're there who lives however I don't personally. Investigated I'm not. Three got to be eager Norstrom organic if you really want be entered. They don't bow and you get dirty money button and get really if you are truly believe out of pot pot of cheese and spinach. And I and I about so called a lot of investigative. Materials that are out there that I had been picked up. Our ignore it from the base hypothesis that we're dealing with the jumping into base. Part of operatives who put it ape like but the man who want to project here don't you that would folks. Built specifically what they park ranger. Won't but in years ago at all or wild fires or nor dictionary. Redwoods in California. And how they recovered. A large male animal it just hate people so that if they couldn't fit in area. Well. Being burned permanently. They couldn't credit. An ambulance. But they. Department of natural resource the federal government. Brought everybody and until and anybody that all of the people that were involved in that paper every event I am aren't ordinary either. Big get it there eight. There are treated. And they view it. And they released it and they were all told it's got what he regards. And your retirement and you'll be quiet and you want. You know her career or attempt to gain any kind of Spain and this particular person it exchange historian but it certainly credible person. And I had credentials to back it up when you look also retired army. So Mario Marcus individual. Shared that story with you despite the warnings from government officials. All right Danny or been many many many years since since then it was a young man. Met pat and you know already retired from the front for a report due to report service ranger and you're worth north fired right no we're gonna break. Back ranks paternity strategy partners. So when was that when was that that that that animal was recovered what year was that. 1999. In the ninety's and out. And I'm sure. It is but. People women. If daddy and he would what they're like it was but it felt. Or that you aren't there and they sent it didn't really it. But they're on you whether you're a bit of a good you know these guys it's well known about you prepared hope there's. You know tiger Reverend Billy is. You know that there are a silent so let him. Hurt let's admit that there are numbered. Well it's live with it. There was a bitter taste with guys really hurt our iron over or not that was burned through it. Ever. It was an individual they're now they're in they're very. We're works there and they're the only way. That it had been in Midland radio we pipeline. It had a number of Eden where they need and have a lot of damage is ever. Really set up. Eight vote there. Though he let up. They're clear about. About our setup where is that I was. Round of the Evan yeah although at bat in the bottom of it. Via a back in that thing. The what he thought was scared. The that are being when he invoked prepared for every where else. It brought people up there to learn that it is one of the blood samples and her blood was not very it will. Apparently. It was Cameron and that are well known for him impending. Well and intersect yeah that's that's great historic mark thanks for sharing that via so let's so let's get yeah BA good I just a job like to get some. I'm doctor Roberts take on that did you hear anything about a story that the mark shared were. Creature. Or wounded burned creature was captured nurtured and released. No what I've heard similar stories. Where. Like someone hit a big throw them out of being incomes up and takes that. These men get all wearing suits and they put it in the back and stuff like that you know I'm I'm I'd be skeptical. On sympathetically skeptical I mean I I simply want to believe. I simply need to be evidence as someone once said. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence I just like some basic evidence to to support that. Okay Leo we're gonna take a quick break the only comeback I wanna get into the subject. If you think the government actually knows about these things and and they've been hiding it from a so. You'll see Jason in GBM via reality review right back. Hey gang it's JP from beyond reality radio reminding you that taps parent magazine is the official publication of the tax organization that's right. If you're dressed in. You need to subscribe to taps her majesty. Now's your chance to do it at a special rate and the best news is that taps apparel magazine has been completely redesigned. And re launched to serve you better. That's right go to the website just taps Karabakh dot com that's task experiment dot com. Click on the subscribe now button and turn the promo code beyond at check out and save even more on your subscription. It's captain paramedic team where every issue was filled with the latest information regarding the kernel community whether it's TV. What's your radio or whether it's happening you're neighborhoods it's. Arab magazine again go to the website tab paramedic dot com. That's happens paramedics got there can't use promo code beyond just. National stage Yahoo! mail and Randy were talking with doctor Robert Bartholomew about big foot. And a couple of books he's written monsters of the north woods and bigfoot encounters in new York and new England and doctor Robert. Before we to break Jay had Pau. To question which and really I've heard reports of like you were saying these are these trucks pulling up in her throwing a creature in the Vatican driving away and and so forth on. Do you believe that the government is aware of these things. And just has kept that they kept it from us. I think it's similar to UFO lose I think the government isn't smarter than anybody else in fact it's probably the house. Are occasionally. You see high up military person claiming that you oppose a real and they'll quote them in some newspaper article. I mean basically that's their opinion. They don't have the evidence released ever release the evidence we haven't got the evidence now all of this WikiLeaks stuff coming out. It would be interesting to see. If there is some UFO related material that comes out that shows the government knows more about. Whether it's big forty UFO is so far haven't. You then I think some documents have been released but it's nothing conclusive whatsoever that they conclusively have evidence so while you know I'm. I have to era on the side of caution just like you guys. Yes and there's been there's actually been other governments that have referred to use the fact that UFO's. Are real and so for them that the American government keeps it from the people. And really try to subdue the information so generally it does it does make you wonder. Yes it does. And I I just think that it's very hard to keep a secret. You're already seeing leaks to the media. All I don't know as is possible to keep a secret. Oh with our government nowadays. And but but look again if it's if it's true. I would think that we keep leaks were found something by now if it ever released that yet. Or maybe they just having gotten into the right emails but I isn't. The whole governments motto is two guys to keep the secret of one's dead. So you gotta sit there worry about that. I guess it's a small yet I guess the place grow sorry go yeah I'd ask the question. Awhile ago and our discussion here. What is the population what how do we have an idea of how many big for its actually exist. Is it a small number therefore making it just that much harder to find them. Or on it I we heard from another researcher that they thought there were several 100000. We'll that's the thing. To have pay. Breeding population. It's not like one old creature that keeps running around. Are in certain areas you're gonna have to have a breeding population. In these different regions and had seen all over the world and it seemed consistently. Iranian you're all in many different parts of the world ends. That's why. I am very skeptical of the flush and logged. Hypothesis. I know for example with the Lake Champlain monster. Amidst an estimated they'd need between 35 and fifty creatures. Have a population that keeps reproducing. Armed with big foot you certainly need all of a certain number. Interesting thing as salt. There aren't that many sightings. Of baby gates. Oracle mother big yet all the Paterson film's supposedly show breasts. But. The vast vast majority of sightings of bigfoot. Our mail like creature. On May be the mother and the baby hero in the cave somewhere short but it just. There's something ill logical about the. Well because if you think about it. For every male and female bigfoot that reproduced they each each pair would have to reproduce. To. You know to offspring and each just to maintain the same population. All parties items I'm surprised no one's come across. And claim to see you know two big foot meeting in the woods or something. Yet known who this is Charlotte in match in the sound they be making there but around her have but I mean it but each each pair bigfoot would have to have to. Two off springs just to be able to maintain a population that's there. Just to maintain that same population so right yeah it's just. I had I analyzed I just darn normal how would all work out. You people say things like well when they die they eat their debt that's why you don't by the body I mean it just. It just sounds too far fetched. Yep there and then you really just to accretion you wouldn't wanna be saying had any intelligence of at that point and just be creepy creepy things are. On the other hand they say that with the utmost X I respect. Because I know. There are thousands of people all the air or oddest. Or sincere. And they have seen something. Truly extraordinary. And they know they saw it. Bob in there and a crazy. So. Temper that comment. What one question that we have that just came in from the chat room. And it's a good question and do bigfoot sightings increase after natural disasters in in the top spot airs. I'm not aware of and what you do get slaps. Periods of intense sightings. Followed ball IE. Gary it's a title level off. Some people said well that's a function of newspaper reports. Newspaper. Reports on a dramatic siding and everybody Eagles looking. And people are usually not looking. So you can argue that it's a function of the mass media. And you can argue it's just all. People looking harder over scrutinizing their environment. Erica rubber when we come back from our break now when actually change the subject a little bit and talk about something that you touched on earlier. The mass hysteria thing you men mentioned in reference to Orson Welles radio broadcast of 1938. I'd like to get your opinion. On the Salem witch trials we had a guest earlier in the week. That we talked extensively about the Salem witch trials and mass hysteria was we is one of the theories probably the most likely of the theories. That was really responsible. For. So many people being accused of being witches and therefore being executed subjecting you to take on that. It's beyond reality radio would Jason indeed via telephone numbers 8446877669. Love to have you call in. And will chat more with doctor Robert berth on the on the other side of the break. On the other read. Welcome back beyond reality radio case Stephen tell. And don't forget tomorrow night there's hope -- but Monday. And most of tomorrow night we have Jim Merrill no Monday we have Jim herald podcaster in the paranormal for very long time. Does a great show we're gonna talk to him about his ten years of shows in the guess he's had and thinks he's learned. Corpus not turn them. Who is. Not only an author and publisher but also a member of the church of Satan is that when yes that is him and we're gonna get to we're gonna you gonna hear from corpus on Tuesday talk a little bit about. What he believes and why. And then Wednesday would go William Keegan an expert of Christopher Columbus with Columbus Day being only a lethal a week ago on the History Channel. At a clip discussing improving a Crist took Christopher Columbus did not discover America. And key you'll be commenting on this clip along with and that and discussing his research on Christopher Columbus. And Friday we've Thursday we've got our old friend dark waters have Nolan who. Honestly just has some great stories takes true and Connors and just what he does Stallone. And telling you can it can be a TV shows champion has some it's just it's creepy. There really is he drama dramatized of them put to music behind them. Has somebody tell the story think he does a lot of himself be as other voice actress tells stories. And just he just too great job anybody who heard him on the program before ruby syndicated. I'm knows exactly what we're talking about in now on those who listened and went listened to his stories could Desmond YouTube. They swear by the rigors great a lot of fun. Yeah easy he's just great to have great cast yep our guest tonight doctor Robert Bartholomew. Author of the book monsters of the north woods. And the book it bigfoot encounters in new York and New England in many many other books actually we've been talking about. The big foot component for the past down. Hour and a half for so but I want to change the subject. Rubber beef for what we were talking about one possible explanation for. This sightings. And this stories in the encounters that you heard from people regarding bigfoot is this whole idea of mass hysteria and the fact that people can be convinced of something just because other people. Are convinced of something. We saw that with Orson welles' famous 1938. Broadcast of war of the worlds that was a Halloween broadcast by the way rates that. Were like talking about that now is very appropriate. Yes I'll look at the Salem witch trials. On. I am convinced was mass hysteria. The evidence is overwhelming. On its re air mass hysteria. Like what happened in Salem to happen in western countries. It's more common in Africa. In Asia in during the Middle Ages sixteen and seventeen hundred's where people believed in demonic possession. And that type of mass hysteria we get to twitching the shaking. When people start on exhibiting demonic possession. Certainly there is a psychological phenomenon. Arm while demonic possession you can argue a certain percentage of those are actual real possessions and but most of that phenomenon. Is as a psychological phenomenon. And that is a psychologist in California. At a university there cheaper imposed the Kirk got hypothesis. That. Before you had to the outbreak in Salem or heavy rains. And they had harvested these light greens. And that she hypothesize. The grains had gone moldy. And you've got or got intimidation. Now or god LSD is a derivative burqa. So people would start hallucinating. And she theorized that people are hallucinating. From eating the bread. Now. That's really not possible. I'll tell you why. Because in Salem and 1691. In 1692. When those girls were doing what you were doing. All of a sudden fall down screen twitch shake and then stop. In or poisoning if you're taking a hit of LSD. You're not gonna stop. On there was a towel in France. In the 1950s. We're guy a bakery bake bread with or got. People on the towel wet stark. Raving. Crazy. Jumping out of windows. You know seeing purple monkeys. It was just and if you have that you just can't stop it. So I'm confident that what happened in Salem was necessary and now what's going out with a big (%expletive) Chip a cog brought all these other phenomenon that's not mass hysteria. Is mass hysteria. Is the rapid spread of illness signs and symptoms. That's not what's going out with a big foot you could call it a social delusion. Or a large group of people believing something was lot of miss identifications and stuff like that. On what it's not masses to area there's a difference between NASA's stereo which is an actual illness. Ends. Socially delusion. And a lot of times with what they were referring to with these girls falling down shaking and a flipping out in Salem has sounded more like it could have been. Certain people dealing with epilepsy and things like that I would have to say you know what about what would you say Emma. I would say no because only understand where you're coming from this is a fairly large group of girls. And it's and it's happening within that quote. There is a phenomenon. I've collected over 2000 cases of mass hysteria. Dating back to thirteen 66 columns. And what's really interest me. Is that. These cases of demonic possession. Clinch game. Shaking. Altered states of consciousness. Still occur today. Almost always in groups of young girls. In Africa. And in Asia. And they happen in schools. With the girls are repressed. Is a lot of oppression they. They're very stroked circumstances. What's really interests and is that. Up until the year 2000. And modern countries these cases haven't been happening. Yeah in the last. Sixteen years since 2000. There have been about ten cases. Of twitching shaking. Altered states of consciousness demonic possession. Happening in the United States. And we don't fully understand what's going on but I think I suspect. Edits social media. Somehow intensifying emotions. And sporting this phenomena. We don't understand that's what happened in LeRoy in Western New York mysterious outbreak. Erica quote him we just recently we're talking about about a month or so ago. This outbreak of possessions and so forth down South America where it's this one tone. And I had this outbreak of possessions and so that would definitely fall into the whole mass hysteria of where new 11 person believed to have been possessed and then for whatever reason everybody in all these people the town. Started dealing with the possession. You know I order a book called how worried encyclopedia of extraordinary social behavior will not fantastic. Story named Hillary Evans. All you mortal lock on the paranormal he's now a past life. And we've documented. In French. In in German. A number of cases during Middle Ages a child's. Having large groups of people exhibiting. Demonic possession in Europe. It was quite a common phenomenon. And now it's kind of gone away any problem but this mysterious. Phenomenon is coming back in the United States. And doctor we've got a couple minutes left here and down there is one of the Sonoma to touch on you wrote a book called American haunt things. The true stories behind Hollywood's. Scariest movies. And again given that Halloween is just a couple of flow weeks away a lot of people are watching scary movies. On your list includes the X assist the conjuring. The Amityville horror basically films that worse spun from. What would be considered. Actual. Occurrences on and off to be true stories and capital lease the reported as such. What do you recommend that people watch and down when they watched the one or two that your gonna select. What should they be looking forward to divide fact from fiction. Well I looked at the end and I went out. And I looked at me. Cases. That have been getting the most attention the Amityville horror. The action since. Conjuring. All the haunting in Connecticut. Hands. You know all right genuinely won't Knoll. Where these are real. Or they've been a real. Ends. The more I looked at these cases. The more I found. That. Was no conclusive evidence that they have been. Exaggerated. In Hollywood are least now there may be real haunting it's in their may be real possession out here. But these are yet and that's the problem. Problem is. That. Dirt there's guys like yourself. On logical. Sympathetic. Skeptical. Hope. And mine did in you go out and you go into the fields and I admire you for that I commend you for that. But people see these films. And when you analyze the actual real case behind the film. It's not the same thing. I mean that the conjuring was so far exaggerated. I'm so out of and it's unfortunate. Because it gives guys like you a bad name are angry with the totally. So what we need to do. Is all there's a balance isn't there they want to sell films. They want to sell tickets they wanna sell dvds or CDs or whatever. Yeah. There's a balance they are because. You want to have some truthful information as well. And I mean my goodness the exorcist. Was. Just our our blown out of proportion. As was the conjuring. And the Amityville horror. And the generally I agree because we've had Christopher a lot's on the show in the past as well and he he honestly came on told sell about that. And doctor where were running out of time but through where can people find more information on your books and so forth. Ice Busch garden club you go Yahoo! Amazon and look up my books. Did you want me to hit the clown stuff. Yeah you know what let's hold onto this break in let's do that when we come back it's beyond reality gradient case. James Derrick Todd might be over for this year but there's another scary kind in the works you owe it to yourself to check out the details go to scary times dot com that's Garrett con. Dot com to sign up for the email list and be informed you need to know what's going on with scary con because it's the best weekend of the year scare coming clean celebrities fans. Vendors parties panel discussions film premieres and so much more it's a weekend you'll never forget it everyone is welcome to. Visit the website scary time dot com that spirit con dot com and. Or Mac OLL radio Jason on Stevie Johnson had a great discussion with doctor Robert Bartholomew mostly about bigfoot. But we didn't wanna bring up the topic of these this this. Pandemic of clowns creepy clowns I mean people are really panic king and kind of don't know crazy about this whole thing which which your thoughts on the whole thing. Well that the clone outpouring. Is a social. Panicked. It's all on a group of people who are earrings some evil and society. And so. If you look at it you have to go back and history. Clones were essentially good until. The late 181890s. In theater and opera. And then you started getting some clowns as being mirrors and wasn't too bad but you started to get a few bass clubs. And then. In the 1930s. In the shadow of the Great Depression. You got its. These large tent circuses that or traveling around America having hard time making ends meet. You had some competition by these inexpensive. On site shows. That feature really creepy. Or clones. And they were designed to shock people they were nicknamed the dark carnival. And so people became aware of clowns being. Evil. Especially with the star carnival evil and horrific. But then something interesting happened. In the nineteen from about 1948. To the early sixties. The two most popular TV shows for kids. With Howdy Doody show with clerical com. Ends. You had also clone and now if you say Bozo it's even part of the American lexicon. So. Clones in the fifties and sixties became associated with kids TV show us. End that's org it's interesting because then you go into the seventies. In the serial killer John Wayne Gacy. Used to dress up as a clone. Him and that came out in the seventies so what has been was. By the early eighties. You started to get this urban legend. Spreading around the United States starting in the Brookline Massachusetts area and Boston around the united states. Of clowns. Hanging out by the end with tinted windows and handing. Standing by the woods. Trying to lure kids would muddy and candy. And that urban legend has been going on pretty much saying. Waxing and waning until recently. But until recently it never home. McClung never got a kid. There were incompetent columns. What happened was in the early eighties when this urban legend developed. Hollywood started making bad cloud movies. And I have counted. From about 1980 to today at least a 186. It's. Killer clown movies. Bank robbing clown movies. Our child abduction movies. And it's got its own genre now. So it's taken out a life of its own. But what's happened this year. Is the same thing that happens. And 2014. Up until then you didn't catch the clone in 2014 in France. There is a hole out upon sightings and then people started dressing as clowns. Going around beating people up and scaring people. It happened before Halloween. In peaked Halloween so I think what's gonna happen is. Gonna have a lot of cases. Of people scaring people before Halloween and during Halloween. It actually beating them up as well and being violent. That's why predict that after Halloween. Is just sort of fade away a year may recur again in the future. But it it's just gonna start. You know Halloween it'll peak. Right mind a one more question before you for human and which ago. Because this this has been plaguing this show for a long time what is the accurate plural for bigfoot. The big four it's man and yet he says squad to. Well let me leave you with the statement that is. I've got to teach these are up one Ph.D. two master's degrees. And I don't know in it's important. It's important for people like me and you. Just say. I don't know instead of claiming to have all the answers. That the only way we're really gonna get the answer isn't it tonight how I don't know. While what are you referred to the man's that you yourself. I say big four big for as a floral as well. I say big foot as the plural as well never XP. And don't. Courage thank you very much for you know taking the time to talk with us tonight you know the year been down with the flu and I would greatly appreciate you fighting through it and hang in Dallas. You know I don't do a lot of shows on the radio. But you guys have an outstanding show. And you have a lot of logic and common sense yet you're open minded at the same time and there aren't a lot of shows out there are like that so I commend you. Thank you very much that means a lot to see here and dome and we have the utmost respect for you see you go get get better and hopefully we'll talk again soon. Have a good day right thank you doctor Robert Bartholomew author. Of many books including American haunting as a true stories behind Hollywood scariest movies and monsters of the north woods and in so many more and what a great guests and a lot of great insight and it was great to have him here on. Absolutely and I wish him the best I hope you rest up paying gets over the flu and a now gets gets better fast. No okay so what do we got coming up next week GA we have Monday we have Jim Harold. Run those terrible podcast. And we're going to be talking with him on Jim what are we return among. Retirement is colonel podcast OK hello one moving on now we corpus and to knock terms and turn them. And he's from the church of Satan and we're going to be talking to him about golf a goth culture and so many different things when it comes down to the paranormal and and how it's looked at through his eyes Wednesday we've got William Keegan he's an expert on Christopher Columbus. And we're going to be discussing. Some stuff for History Channel just had a clip this candid. Proving how Christopher Columbus did not discover America and we're gonna talk with William Keegan on that. And also just as his research behind Christopher Columbus in the Thursday we've got dark waters are very good friend of ours from new loans and in which age you would that night just dim the lights. You know yes it set yourself up with some popcorn and apart probably partially minute and a yeah its key rate is he has some incredible stories just to. It armor are great entertaining guy I mean there's lot of great followers to and they tend calling in a few months so it it's a lot of fun. A to have them on the program. Don't forget to stop by the FaceBook page give a likely we really want it to connect with us there are so we can keep keep you informed of what's going on. And also stop by via website says hello there. And make sure you you you join us next week we've done now those great programs coming up we've got a great Halloween. Program lined up with Chris quarantine a Lutz who is one of the children that lives through twenty days of horror in the house in Amityville that. That is now known as the Amityville horror. How's dad and it's and it's going to be great show that night but big shout outs all the the new listeners tonight and everybody listening online everybody listening on the very channels that we are on. May shed over to FaceBook dot com slash beyond reality radio and like our page. And you'll have a safe weekend and enjoy your weekend and we'll catch you all and just couple days on Monday this Jason NGV I'm beyond reality radio talk you so I. Are there is produced by the veterans include perhaps Alexandria Johnson and hungry and don't forget to stop playing our FaceBook page and give us a lie can say hello leads beyond reality radio all one word. If you've got information you want us to follow up on or you'd like to be Gaston beyond reality radio email too slick Eddie. That's slick Eddie ED DY at beyond reality radio dot com thanks for listening.