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Gun Talk 2-14-16

Feb 14, 2016|

Particular firearms, ammunition, different types of recreational and competitive shooting, hunting, even politics. We do not talk about conspiracy theories, though -- no black helicopters, please.

Transcript - Not for consumer use. Robot overlords only. Will not be accurate.

Loved it. It's time to load up bugs and intellectual ammunition with Tom cousins gun talk it doesn't matter if you learned to shoot with the Daniel boon for your brand new. You're welcome here this is the original national talk show about guns and Tom Gresham is your guide through the maze of ballistics and politics. So grab your phone and call him right now. 8668255. Or 864 just dial one job we talked. Now here's stop. To date on Tom grisham's go and talk. We're talking about the importance of gun safes and continue training. Plus you're range reports Pope John however they think six talk guy and that's 866 vodka and no this stuff. Where oh. Welcome again to go and talk just shows you might imagine our intro was recorded before leaving until half way day of course. Starters Friday said he isn't all word of this foreigners into Kremlin just just got back in town gone for a week and as I literally. Bruce pushing the plane into the hangar. Get a text shows. Justice Scalia has died. Who only tell. You cannot even imagine I've I don't know that you could fully appreciate. The firestorm the impact the important. And that of course we're talking about Supreme Court justice Antonin Scalia. Who wrote. The Heller decision. A brilliant. Piece of writing I. Highly recommend you take an hour or so some evening. And Jewish reader it is something else. So what does that mean the Republicans are saying well we're just not going through. Approve anyone the present economic word is not going to confirm. Anyone who should be the decision of the next president which of course the Republicans are gonna say Kazaa you don't want to. President Obama's nomination whomever. That your turn out to be on the show the other side the Democrats are saying well it's the duty of the president's hindered the senator dependent but here we go again. Round and round and round we go. How important is this well Heller and McDonald decisions. Which either being on your viewpoint reaffirmed or established. The concept. That we have an individual right to keep and bear arms. Both of those decisions were 54. Well actually there's more for spying program that we're good let's look at. The secretary what do the right now who better. To talk. About the importance of Justice Scalia and his role and actually what he was like a man who's argued troop key. Vitally important sec remember cases before the Supreme Court we're joined right now by none other than Alan gore Colin thank you so much for joining us. Well thank you for having me calm even under these that circumstances it's always nice to be the trend that nerves which you're. All right let me ask you before we get into the what does that mean we're going to be goal you argued two cases before the Supreme Court I may be more those are the two are unaware of and okay just poster obviously. You have been grilled by Justice Scalia you're seeing him at work. Just kind of fan for most of us who have no exposure to your mother than what we saw in the news impression she. What Justice Scalia was obviously brilliant legal mind and it was. Always on top of his game and I think that even his detractors of people who may not. Has agreed with simple possibly. Would concede and everybody you're universally almost admit. And that Justice Scalia made major contributions of the way that we read the constitution. He developed an expounded upon doctrines that. Really shaped the course of the law. In more so than it is significant individual contributions in terms of opinion he'd written in particular case is he really had an outsize impact on the way the law. Is discussed and viewed and understood in this country and he's going to be missed course. Didn't she go without saying that before we look at his. Work product is contributions to our to the court and United States the deeply personal loss just as clearly behind. I like nine children large extended family and for those who knew them end up in the we're. Didn't enjoy it directly. Been contacted mrs. this is the time for a morning in and it's a loss now of course were discussing just what we have because he was. Remember the Supreme Court and it's only natural that people want to explore what this means for for the future but. Outlook release reflect for a moment on the fact that this is the human being. Who is searcher for many people and a personal level and a family that's creeping so well keep those Lennar dot urged. Absolutely and it is interesting how. How he how is actually universal on your right. What do you were on the Ryder on the left for the metal or where you are on his decisions every one of the very last person is always said. Throughout the last week for hours the man was utterly brilliant and he also. Now look your return if you would to that one thing. He'd change vote not just a conversation we changed the way the conversation takes place. About constitutional law what do you mean by that. Or Justice Scalia was or at least what usually not always but usually. What one might call an original meaning that. When he came to the court he is doctrine that you that he tried to bring into the conversation yet is the constitution means. That should be understood as that meaning whatever is meant to the people wrap it that is. The doctrine must have some meaning it must hasn't contacted avenue where we want to. It's it is fairly useless document it all means is. Go ahead and make some decisions about speech make whatever decisions about gun do you think are reasonable well we don't need a constitution for. By the does help that there are certain rights. And we have to first decide. We're or discover what goes right commenced to the people who ratified that and so we look to meet and to have true meaning of attacks Abu understood by the people ratified it. And then we try to apply that meaning two to modern day that is today. A mainstream way of looking at a law it was not so one just clear first came to the scene. And he really did help advance. The recognition of original wasn't. As saying that they that injures credentialed doctors I think you aptly Bure Berkshire that. More so perhaps than any particular decision. Well I loved her Ortiz said robust means that the constitution does not lay out a living document has. If you want a change in the largest dirty old fashioned way write a new all or change the constitution but don't ask us to change. That's right and he would always say that you know at the constitution and if you want to be living dot. That means it has to mean what the framers saw it back if you want to get constitution. That I have a constitution means whatever you want to edit actually get a more a function. It just sit there in your mold it into whichever route commute you happen to want to keep time. That was dead constitution that's the the weighted that he described it wouldn't quite back. Last night. That's been so how do you prepare knowing you're going to be standing there in front of all the justices but of course the Justice Scalia because no matter who you war. Haven't beat bush forty tell he was aggressive in his question was you know. But he was amended no way to prepare for in your particular justices obviously try Q. Anticipate the questions of the concerns. That the court might have been you do look at their. Individual. The background things they've written the belief it is expressed and try to sort of ascertain what this particular members of the court might. Might be an ancient discussing. When that's said and done that we do prepare for that and he broke cases were booted. Very heavily that as we had a lot of practice sessions I can say that at the end of the day though your case your case you you have mission. You have for the backs we have a record that you're dealing with. And you have certain objectives and certain things to what you believe you have certain. Doctrine that you and your client are trying to establish. And you need to present those who of course you want to be ready for the concerns of the court might have at the end the day you can't change what would your about. Just because there's a court may not like it if how to develop defense during an argument for example that. All lined justices hate the Second Amendment to picket the clutch the right. Well that may well be but I'm not going to agree that position is to make him happy obviously. The courted the court you try to prepare for a you try to deal with it but if he would get a day it's it's helping your case. You present your are your best guess I I noticed that Tom Goldstein from sort of Smart as that. You more liberal replacement for Justice Scalia is very likely to overturn the supreme court's recent recognition. Of a Second Amendment right to possess firearms or at least. Render it technology. As a practical matter. Possibility. I grew. I figured out completely. That that aptly the case I've been saying this for for very long time. We have seen. That the Heller opinion while the fantastic opinion. And it has a lot of beautiful great protection for Americans says secular right it doesn't really mean a whole lot of in the judges who would ignore it. And some judges follow it carefully whether they like it or not they they adhere to it for better or worst. But many courts unfortunately we've seen many lower courts are simply refused to comic insult the decision and we have acacia profound that massive. Resistance to this decision. And it's something that's been noted not just by the end and other folks some of the program side. But even anti gun people arrived at at this point lead isn't that a large you are will that be off site written by former attorney for the great center. A bruise now professor Liu not in Kansas City up and need he talks about justice breyer's triumph that. That that courts or. You know acknowledging the court tend to follow Justice Breyer bench for. Applying so called intermediate scrutiny essentially holed just about any. Gun law that they might couple blocks and so. But in point of fact that was not the majority opinion that was the descent. That's correct but it's its technology on both sides to dispute did not just something that you know pro gun people are saying because we're trying to. Agitate to work that I know that this is acknowledged by both sides now. Bet there's a lot of resistance to the Heller opinion and so when you look at the way things are now while it still supposedly good law. What would it look like when you're talking about a quart that god. Five members who come from a place that does not accept Heller and unlike lower courts. There are actually down by Heller because they can just overrule. So it instead for very long time that any change in the court. Would jeopardize this opinion given that still how precarious and acceptance. And it's been almost a college. The next. President and have you have got outside and back. The exact you'll also hear how we will talk about that Allen girl whose horse who argued one Heller decision there. Seriously McDonald's case before the Supreme Court where we talk where they'll be leaving us defaults on. Who's running. On the GOP side I just speak for those who haven't figured out yet Hillary Clinton's very Oprah does he says very simply. All the Heller decision on the Second Amendment the Supreme Court got it wrong in other words she Vick to the Supreme Court said you have arrived to keep and bear arms. The Supreme Court used wrong can you imagine. And justice for nomination we forget. From that we'll be right back. And are Americans who are rebelling girl portion attorneys who argued and won the Heller who's Madonna decision before. The Supreme Court obviously talking about the death justice Antonin Scalia interestingly enough for a while hunting in west Texas. How I'm. How do you explain to people how important. This vacancy is. Well this vacancy is important so many ways not just talking about the Second Amendment advocates of gun talk we'll just leave it. The Second Amendment on the ballot this election and if it is tragic of the that passing of Justice Scalia is in a way that this is not really news at people been saying for a very long. Given the composition of the Supreme Court she just look at the actuarial tables. Not nice but it's in the it would it has always been extremely unlikely. That we would see no retirement sort of agency's. Between now and say 20/20. When the net and presidential term expires so we've known that the supreme court's going to change. This just sort of that confirms. What is the what's been expected and when you have a court that has. There are so evenly divided on the second issue we think. And it Leo the author of colors and has left us. Then. You know if you are played by someone who takes the other side of that view given the complete lack of respect Forestar decisive when it comes to things that. Our side chronicle winds. The Taliban be gone and it's going to be gone it's going to be gone. Senator Pryor rather later and you have actually no secular protection rights at all in court. Off forever and then that decision of course will be all that's settled law would correct there but hey this is. You know holy richt and so you know don't expect it to be you know on done immediately. In the right direction so. Look if we get a good justice who. And it couldn't somebody have an agenda I mean this is not somebody who ought to get back into it we have different legal culture in America. And if a president is nominee in a cousin who loved the second look at all the Barack Obama loved me and he doesn't look upon that the you sincerely says that he wants to defend your individual and all right. It doesn't matter if he is fishing in a pool. Nominee is and cultural place where for a lot of we don't file reasons they're they're not going to be protecting secular rights you're gonna lose those rights in so. It's very important that we. You know get a ride to election. If not then. And you know I I would not to expect Allen to survive until. Inauguration day but I point 11. Saw Helen goes away and we were and you toward younger we lose our sucker memorized for all intents and purposes the you have some thoughts on. This election coming up when you say it's OK a five where you know Matt Capps. You know I. I usually don't. You know make. Are stuff away not I don't. Get involved usually but you know I think there were very fortunate to have. At least one candidate in this in this election I can see you actually unlike most candidates on both sides really. Election understands the Supreme Court doesn't have a fairly good working a chip that senator Ted who's. You know full disclosure Ted is that the fire might have gone years. So perhaps. It yet but even better because I've known him and not somebody I would want a vote what I think there's a while a lot of and he could get it right near somebody who's not screwed up. And these are unique cases in front of Supreme Court. I'm committed this Second Amendment is totally unwavering. He has. He is somebody who would expend political capital if he had to. Fight for a nominee. Ku word more likely than not get the Second Amendment question correct. And while I would be. More comfortable potentially with other nominees than than others. Well this one where I think it you know we can all be buried very comfortable with. If prefer if it's present cruises you know making these calls and who's nominated to the bench and I think it is uniquely. Qualified sent to make these decisions and so if it is important to you. Then that the consideration should go in your in your analysis you'd decided who you might want to vote for. Interest you guys just were saying yesterday before said. If this doesn't make deport if and I remember talking about the supreme court for a long time and the elections are about the Supreme Court make no mistake. And now people go oh this torture talked about a year or your fist doesn't get you to be all Leon on the gun owner and someone who. Respects and loves Second Amendment I don't know what would amend my home yeah I'm talking about. Bill signing you have given money volunteering put up signs do whatever you can do making calls talk your friends. They are actually everything don't leave anything conduct on the Digisette import alert the former go back to yourself I'm. Al Gore. Bruised. The guy that Heller McDonald says. If we lose this sheet we lose. Heller we lose McDonnell and for all intents and purposes. We lose the Second Amendment because I am I overstating the. No you're overstating it I think it's a matter of time that what happens in that may get me wrong I mean look it is nothing that ever actually get it may be. President Sanders. You know nominate somebody you move. Has is. You know the president's Sanders former UConn gone right back when he was from overbought but rather what you shall the last. You know but it's never a guarantee but is that you you gotta look at the probability here. And the fact of the matter is that the other side. You know it takes nominee is sort pool of people who for a lot of different reasons they don't view. The secondary is very important even if they believe it's an individual like an hour ahead. In the heart of hearts. We will tell you that they'll truly believe what they're saying wanna say that yes but actually Detroit to have a gun. The fact is that a lot of these so called from places where nobody had the gun. Nobody would admit to having gone. That we know of anybody who who moved all the categories. In this debate could probably got in in the gun debate generally speaking. If you don't see any value if you have no use until stood in and guns every restriction looks reasonable. Let's say you know I give away everything your view I give an opening thing because nobody I know no reasonable person would have ago and hasn't. For him forget the whole second she soft scripts like now look I've got to run my friend thank you so much are you. I talked to last minute and I really appreciate you being an abrupt. It probably already. And it. All right thank you Allan girl while. They go. Do your friends get it do you get it have you. Talk to people over the last 24 hours call me 866 talk earned and 866. Talk going on. What are your thoughts on this board will review he. Sign up for our guns our newsletter enjoy the truth squad at www. Gun talk dot com. Now back to guns are with The Washington Times opinion page regular contributor to our aggression. You wish you say Maya. He says The Washington Times last week I was writing about why gun control as a loser. For the Democrats historically and why you're asking the question why in the world of the decided that now are safe for them to come on these. I'll come out Heidi must prove that come out of hiding. On gun control finally they're saying yeah we blow gun control yes would they prepare really is no sec remembered. Right to own guns Hillary Clinton saying we're the Supreme Court got it wrong with Hiller though they said there's just Sacramento right to keep and bear arms there's not. Well. It would couldn't do that they tend to lose. Obama way. Quick note if you have gotten Helio are out. On your Schwartzel be sure to updated to the latest bill we keep adding. Improvements and new things to it so make sure you get the latest build. Honestly probably the easiest way. Most effective way this deleted from your phone and then put back on their your good believes bill does a me right now were things we just did. Whereas now we are listening to go and talk in this for the podcast. It's actually more user friendly than has been the pastor will remember which when you were listening to their resume when you go back to really great. Which also be a great way if you're talking too much hate you believe we're just heard a longer Tuesday. On gun talk Al Gore just endorsed Ted Cruz island grove just said. That they left leaning justice. And do Supreme Court. Will be the end of the Heller decision the end of McDonald's isn't the end the end of the second. Amendment in this from a guy who's argued those two kids before. The Supreme Court huge huge huge. News coming out on the show urged few minutes ago. Library built roads out of Mississippi. All year thoughts on what we do with this election. The armed first of all thank you very much for having to Ellen grown that was very informative and also very frightening. I. And ma. That question to Rita was calling in particular though is. Wanted to make a suggestion in regard to voter registration for the call for the elections. It seems like we might be able to do something if gun dealers and the sportsman in general rose who. So firearms and ammunition and sporting goods. If they got on board with. Providing voter registration. Forms. In their places of business. And perhaps just asking customer loses is the transaction torn on it state. Needed to update your. Voter registration or may be re registered they've moved or something like I'm not asking people directly if they voted if they York. Register to vote just off a bit. There's a possibility. Exactly and Gore's. That primary to vote for art in the are the original deadline bureau vote. In primaries is coming right up but we're talking by the general election this port either a great idea the idea of gun stores saying hey we would help you with your voter registration are you registered to vote have you moves into last time. Kids are so that we can help with all that how bout that would darken our great idea bill thank sir appreciate here's an idea. People who want to get involved okay eight. Here's a thought. Talk to people who put on your local gun show I'll betcha there are gun shows right now new investment or not. Rather than give a boost to set up to sell guns. How about you refute your buddies get together and have a boost may be donated by the show organizer. To register. People to help with their voter registration. Christian churches are if they're out a gun store under and Cheryl Portland store. Then figure out how to vote. In the election and instructor job to tell me how to load yourself and get registered to church just a ton of people gun owners were not registered mode can't vote if not registered. If you don't vote. You can't help us there we're gonna need every single last. One of our votes. This time. Let's see. Must go to two marshals Russa and Reno about Marshall. Are martial here actually goes yeah. I just let. I don't. Undergrad. Turn it got a radio turning all this dementia man. OK I don't have a radio on this cult sort of build him up like just go back another time. We are not sounds I can hear you go for. OK so what I'm getting out is that I'm the Second Amendment a lot of our friends from both sides of this issue so. Well meaning whether they're Republican or Democrat or in between there anywhere else. Support the Second Amendment. But they only support parts of it and oh look I'm wondering is you know we're going to suffer a lot of in addition inexpensive struggle. If we can't get together on it because to me the the Second Amendment. I support the second member about sparkles like a little bit and I think that. What are our PC you'd have to explain what that means because. When you know your can't figure around here you're not say what you are so you're you're not their yards saying what you wanna say your dancing around to get to the port what part are you saying that all of us ignore. Well some people ignore the part that says let you know we have a right to bear firearms and and some people ignore the part that says. We have a right to a well regulated militia. And you can't you can't. You can't embrace the Second Amendment effectively. Without it being too divisive if you don't embrace the whole sort of remembered. This is what I'm getting yet. There you still know it's around what are you talking about Marshal straight. While trying to use OK we have a right to bear firearms that's the second article that to come in the middle of the Second Amendment. The first part of the Second Amendment says that we have a right. To a well regular admit militia. That's necessary for the security of Patrice say well if we don't allow the regulation to make sure that children don't kill children were unloaded firearms and always don't have. Ways. Keeping. Regulating people who people's behavior with guns it is detrimental to everyone else. Then then that the purpose of this Second Amendment as it was probably envisioned by the founders. Is deceit and it. You don't Hillary. Won. I I don't I don't get what you're so usually if we. How we equating. Not allowing children to get guns to a militia and I'm not following up on a one knew there we're here but I am not followed you my friend. Well I won't want is. What this regulation mean. In the. Okay well struck such a shout stop stop. That's a great question regulation means well practiced and will drilled period parade stop that's old news. Well lets Philip the Second Amendment says if it. That's exactly what the second member of setup sorry no no no no no. That's exactly what the Sacramento says. A well regulated militia which means is practiced leaders organized it has been put together and so if you looked at these. Federal papers if you look at with the language wasn't the time it all the constitutional scholar ships just a well regulated militia regulated the term doesn't mean constrained. It means practiced. In real old incompetent that's all. The regulated. Meets. Have yet. If you hit the ball is part of militia is is is using weapons to rub stormed. Or do intimidate other people. Or is doers not go to not controlling this fire and it's such a way that you know you have. Huge deal children killing children and in the home were guns do not. I'm we will. OK we've we've had enough to control you know are good and I love to start out adore children they're your story go on write this and we know. Support the Second Amendment. But. EU. They can that we ever you throw in the butt. Then the drug get upset. I want lots of regulation and I ought to restrict gun ownership I want to do this end if you don't agree that. Then you're ever it's like I remember it really have you lost your freaking money. 866 taught your. Of course you can we have seen announcer Grassley sent home. Sitting president should not make the nomination. We should wait and let the next person. Make the nomination really. I mean ilk I get it senator Miller took GOP would like to have happened. No one in the right mind thinks that's going to happen pres Obama is going to make a nomination is gonna send it. The senate. And the real question here. I'm glued to bring it up. Is. Is it possible. For the GOP. To go to Amazon and buy a spy game. Because they certainly don't have Warren. And nor have they exhibited and wanton. Reward Biden remember. Spineless. Spineless weasel its. All were going to do delay we're not going to approve the nomination. We're gonna make sure doesn't come up really. And as soon as the media turns up the heat. Start calling you obstructionist. And start saying well this is going to affect the GOP's. Candidate. As possible here presidential election and Bob Bob Bob Bob blah blah you will fold like a cheap cute guy or her case. Because that's what you do. There's that tortured to. Because you still want people to light Q as opposed to understanding that it's all about. Doing what needs to be done which requires you to exercise power which she is going to make you unpopular. So. While I would love to think the GOP crude in fact. Rummage around may be in the Smithsonian museum and find a spine. I am not. Expecting it I expect them to do as they always have done them. That brings us to clinching point. Could we approve Bardem was a spy. Could we buy dinner it's called hundreds and thousands and tens of thousands and hundreds of thousands and militants. Off calls emails text or letters. We express any thing any type of communication tell them no no and no. Sit on that don't do anything. Yeah how we can do. Now aggression comes to we have despite. When you can we do it today but that we do tomorrow and then we do it next week and then we do the next week and then we do it every single week for the rest of the year. There loan you a requirement like spin. Ninety seconds. To forward. Don't get me started do not. Get me started jump the line for music and Novak and Nebraska again. Well good afternoon. I really I don't know why call and you said in the last few words exactly what I was going to say. I'm really I really enjoyed the way you took apart the comments of the last caller. Oh when he started talk my stomach just turned over. I was running well. Is she going to get to say what he wants to say or his calm going to get out there and tell everybody what he really has to say. Really appreciated thank you. We are your job your drug use drugs found him. Every single time without a single exception someone starts off we. What are you support the Second Amendment it means he doesn't. Now if they've terminal which definition within an and that's why I support the second member that's different deal. But I have never ever ever seen anybody who support to Sacramento starting off with what I support the Second Amendment. Does that owns or followed by a lot. That's true mark. Yeah are you out. Really didn't call in about that I I was gone right. Your comment. And then I was going to comment on two. Soundbites that I had heard last week one of them was McConnell. Who says is that the senate is not going to oppose. Obama any thing of Obama's. During the election. These are we're going. Your comment was Hillary Clinton. Who said. Well who better than Barack Obama to serve on the Supreme Court. Thought it up a big. Yeah there OK there you go I mean for those who haven't figured out that's exactly Jim I appreciate you don't gonna get there but you help me get there. Hillary Clinton would put Barack Obama on the Supreme Court. Are you frightened to now. Are you motivated. Now old. Eric Rocco Bob May disable hello Eric Holder. Mr. gun runner fast and furious and she well. If you are not involved in this shame on shame shame here. All of a lot. We'll just talk about today and a little on the show and talk about instructors fire struck herself that's instructors. What's the video we're we're we're seeing him everybody growing their operator beards and are not be a beard come on and how much operator like in early. They're doing stupid stuff. With guns on your two. And people don't know the difference. And we have instructors popping up all over the employees. Do you. With your instructor has any credentials. Or did you just cool look at it and kept cool and has not where your beard. The worst five elevenths. Copies all that stuff be copied from weird to people. In endangers. Students we're talking about that it's gonna mix Lieberman had good I like that may be to make them think. Also regard about storing your guns safely. Because we all learn. The responsible ones we all learn. The world to help people owned shoot and store their guns safely we all her. The ones who have helped dropped. Gun accidents. And actual issue just of children to the all time low in history. This first long years the National Safety Council been recording these. The number not. The numbers the lowest it's ever been why is that because we'd. And education and safe. The other side is and abandoning. Olmert on line three out of Texas. Homer what are your mind here with starter Kreutz. Yes sir that Tom I think. As crude I would didn't either obviously it is every bit I would. Birdied my first bird this year and supreme court judge. Go to Asia too young guy you've got aboard cheered them. Well I'm. I hear what you're saying but here's the thing is there's no mechanism for that to happen because if we brought home how thin the is not gonna nominate Ted Cruz. Through these Supreme Court that's not gonna happen. And you know whoever I kind of doubt that whoever news or Riordan and here's the deal for GOP candidate gets elected. Then it probably doesn't matter a lot will probably get a pretty good nominee for the Supreme Court. If a Democrat. Of which you meet it'll be Hillary Clinton make no mistake much can be Hillary Clinton. A gift she chosen she's a candidate she gets elected to makes no difference she won't pick a leftist. Justice and then probably another and then probably one more. And to quote Alan gore. There's a commitment over. It's over. You can have a Second Amendment it could be sue their writing. But if you can't get your rights are upheld in court. If they can take your guns away. If they can restrict what you could owner where you could carry it when you can use it how many rounds of animal you can own. And they will progress they are doing good now as much as akin. You have real second and then. So. To perform important element. If Hillary Clinton were Bernie Sanders if Hillary Clinton gets elected. The Second Amendment is gone. Not initially and that that is telling gore. Superstar rock star turn you argued Heller case and argue the ground based in won them both before the Supreme Court. Monumental and mark's Second Amendment cases which he says even now are being ripped away and shredded by a lower courts. If we don't get some reinforcement. On the Supreme Court we lose. Thus Second. Amendment there's no coming back or charged and that is this is not your Somalia where we're cannot do that few years no. I know we talk about thirty or forty years for Supreme Court. Just distributes. Select they'll pick somebody in her forties or early fifties. Chuck Connors Kevin untouchable sport are you prepared to. To do. We'll use to be involved where you volunteer we do workers. Take a look let's talk about safe storage of guns quite hear all guns talk. You are dead hello. It's time to load up on some intellectual ammunition with some questions gun talk it doesn't matter if you learned to shoot with the Daniel boon for your brand new. So welcome here. This is the original national talk show about guns and talking Gresham missed your guide through the maze of ballistics and power. So grab your phone and call him right now 66682554864. Just dial one top dog gone. Now here's John. This is Tom Gretchen good jock now available on iTunes and other podcast clients and on the free gun deal Leo Smartphone app for iPhone and android feel free get colds are now at one Tom dart gun and 48668255486. Or email Tom at gun talk dot com now once again here's stuff. How he usually we have much much much talk about today we're going to be talking about more about justice scalia's death and what that does for the Supreme Court. What that does for the Second Amendment actually. If you ordered last hour we've had around the world on here Allen girl. Course the super star attorneys who argued the Heller and McDonald case is before the Supreme Court winning both of them blocking down our Second Amendment Rights. He was very clear he just says this is very simple reason. If we get a liberal left leaning and anti Second Amendment justice to the court it is the EU India. On McDonnell. Is the end. Of Heller. Anywhere further east it is the end of the Second Amendment. Now those are what you should most other sec remember it will be lying written a document. But at the Supreme Court says you don't have a right to keep and bear arms which is what they you shed that's what. Hillary Clinton said she could say in the Supreme Court got it wrong and there is no individual right to own a gun. Hit the Supreme Court revisits this and should ask you bet then you will have no rights when you go to your local court her district court. You're appellate court or any other court you're go to so important fact. Eleven on Twitter to register we're really don't know well constitution works. Yeah yeah you're right now why in the world would we ever listened allegory about the prosecution. There. It's the end of the Second Amendment. Does that not going to take it up to get an Alameda Boris is this is what the socialism be considered public all settled. Law. We. Visited. We had Herbert Donald then we realized we had made a mistake. We the court we took it up again and we. Fixed yet. And it will not come up again. In many lifetimes. Root for Florida. Our first worked argument about. Gun safety because you know we are of course the responsible ones we would want to keep and bear arms responsibly we own gun safely respond Sri restored memory slot and we use them responsibly. Where the want to push for education were the ones who teach gun safety classes where you want to put tens of millions of kids for the eighty glue gun avoiding. Programs. And on an individual level we make sure that our guns don't fall and two on authorized hands which brings me. To our guest Brandon Payne joins us from liberty save Brandon how are. I'm doing great summer you. I am great I mean your your guys the receiver course biggest safe guns they've company. If you make the big shapes the huge save certain lord knows they're great I have one of them it's full. But no surprise right arrows fall. A little door. It is the rare or whatever you want this big enough or. So be chili's you get enough problem that you go but you have your. There could not not recently but be good you know. For a while now been introduced small gun safes gum ball shoot fewer lives than nowhere to put it this your place we can keep your. Can go and where it's available to you for self defense. But unauthorized people large people like kids. Or other people in the house they can't get to right. Yeah that projector or you know what got the big saves for your bigger guns. But if you want quick access we wanted to kind of try and an opportunity to chill that niche and ensure that Mitch Berger products. And so we came out what he called defenders seriously HD series. From that station. Basically that consists of such sixty tomorrow storm now kind of entry level Ki ball and so very simple no shortage you accessed to. The most advanced biometric access. And involved on the market. And Algeria are a little you may do the same thing I don't know we have discussed this but the key. Multiple and I'm looking into web such like 49 bucks or there's not a lot of money. Are you used before I actually put a gun in that when I'm traveling. So that if our way. Have to I don't like to refer him to leave a gun in a hotel room percent. I can't put it in a locked. Vaults inside a piece of luggage. Where I have at least some. Restrictions on access to it. Just one more earlier I guess so I'd like we are all alike the other words but that's what I'm always I used a little small like one that they are the people. Yet that that's that's an excellent point you know the all of our all filled are are actually FSA. A crew they meet those guidelines that are California DOJ accrue. But culture very much into process to engineers manufactures all of these often mentioned they're gonna provide yeah an adequate level security. -- for what they're doing we're just protecting your article and you know you can't rely on her the face. Or so called say they haven't hotel room search. Our I'm traveling and are. I just just our story about how easy it is for people to break into a hotel slaves. Yeah yeah you know it's it's not I know exactly who got trapped so you know taken the initiative yourself it is usually about that these are small enough and portable but you can certainly do that. Our tell me about the U bio metric part of this because you guys are doing some cool stuff with that. Yeah you know arms over the last decade biometrics of its kinda had a little bit of a bad name because there's been some very. On reliable biometrics in the past split. We you know obviously we're Liberty's safe we wouldn't we wouldn't brings something out that there wasn't gonna work. Adequately so we got this this by how much are accessed that we've engineered to our extra excellent fit in east get to fifty and it's an amazing how much you can works extremely extremely well it's got a very very. High efficiency rate. Everything that we don't step on my church makes it a pot beyond what's out there are so when you swipe your finger it's gonna open and that's what you want when you when you're gonna. And the ball. And you got these vaults that are. Put inside the night stand you can put more pop on the night stand you can you're used to mount them wherever you want. And you've got more subtle hole in one handgun but they also got a little bit larger warns it will hold either two handguns or maybe a handgun no light. Or maybe a handgun and some jewelry or maybe ill I don't know your. What people actually put in race. Yes you know that's a great question obviously. Guns record number one thing that people put it on but there's a lot of things he did you might wanna locker canal unit just in my house let's get cute and sometimes the air trial I don't want to claim that electronics I'll take you know the guy patter or whatever and I'll let him and Hank and oh and then when when they wanna back that I have you wanna give the tournament. There's other uses as well there's going to be concerned wished. On the label we don't always think about like medications. Or maybe wallet or your own. Don't work you know also anything the cherry liqueur that you want to have quick access to put your warm nature can't walk up the bill or beat in honor all dressed hand you know that's. That's what these British foreign and you know we can make a couple versions that are capable of holding more than one gun or a gun and other valuables as well. I wanna dress up I've heard people say yeah sure well. That's gonna slow me down get into my guess. My answer to them Brandon has has always been. Yes. It is slower than just having a gun loaded gun sitting out on top of your mind state no doubt about it but you know. We make allowances we make changes when we get kids and I commend our homes. We put a little from covers into the electrical outlets and that's a pain we put a little. Luckily he is on cabinet door so they can't get them to poisons and things like that and that's a pay it and we'd we make some changes. Am. What you want is you don't have the least amount hindrance in getting to a gun that you need. But you actually positively must make a sort kid can't get them there that's number one thing. How should take typically for sure the bio metric for your swipe them pop open the door. Yeah that's a great question are very important. The biometric social but for the quick access when it's plugged into the AC power which the 250 council coming here after the war Turkey is. Can be bought at an option when it's put these two car is Lester who wants. So coming you simply swipe your finger and the door also open tenure there I mean if they're taking more punters. Shake up skirt the sleek period no storm will the future teacher turned on you know so. Look at senator Cantwell and long and the doors popped over. Oh yeah yeah I mean it's just this cookie that literally is just couldn't you couldn't Flickr finger it will open in minutes it's not on the AC power it takes. It yet this sort of thing that fur have to sort and that's why so it takes one point 62. Set its. Well that's still matter. Yeah has little mogul Saturday. And yet that's not gonna but not going to be concerned smoke socially to the push button combos. And also we have coming back and back and do those and in under three seconds so you know it's well worth the peace of mind and end. Protection. That they offer to be able to. Access to guns and make sure your kids aren't accessing them it will work that. And that's good speed that you're sacrificing is not enough to make. The award marks just some Smart that I followed a group we're fine point arc. It tells me shall think about you if you had your gun and you have a secured vs if you had your gun and you don't have secured. Charles real lot about your responsibility people who were responsible really okay. If you have kids or noon or via Greg is a visit. Or if they pick a log into my kids would never do that yet or do other kids or promote your house okay. And all good let me just say one more thing yes your kids will do that you think they won't and they will. You just have to know this is a given you have to have this. That's a great point and then that's really charming you know I am fortunate Alden and they know accounts are they know it all they know that they're not. Meant to be touching them but. Oil what I am most concerned about is different and may not have that same training you know a lot of lot of kids these days I may be different than fifty years ago a judge. These days they'll do you urbane manner you know the gun is the only thing you know so it's important that we protect not only their own camera what others as well. Looks like he got some special deals going look at a new website they're not receive dot com reflect the prices on these handguns say keeping them. Yeah yeah they really have had a great hardship you. Extremely high quality product so you know forget the name liberty are emailed him in this commander's job. What they go Liberty's safe dot com brand thank you I appreciate what you guys do because they're good products and help us all be safer. And that's good thing regular shrimp are. We're not certain. Are you take care I would open lines million range reported got a comment you think about Justice Scalia what you Republicans who should they dig their heels like no no no. These are the other way to go. Will you help them grow spying will you. The call right text or email them every single week. They say keep up by age do not give me and if you others can get beat up on this you know that's coming. Obviously that's working if we were approached Obama get one of his nominees are nominally been through it moves pretty court. Don't take my word for Allen girl just told you right here it's the end. Of the Second Amendment not overstating things. Gone dude to host its two day. What are you prepared to do 866 tall guy. Are you can join us just dial one Tom talking going to be archived in the email on the go and talk to dot com. Along toward Iran that go and talk lot of ways to communicate. Mike is done exactly that he told us is a lie and warned traveling through Nebraska hey Mike your own gun talk. Deep down that stopped yet. That had a track record of good fortune to all popular vote out of liberty say Ben Ali prominent. From their facility and to some other distributors. Probably truckers like you have good thank you so. Even more qualities than other recent dual. Just applaud it's been my. Plus or wallet well. That the Second Amendment that skip first amendment rights. I don't offend anybody let it go to a viable. Other book of messer. You know there you rate pillow while he Bruce and nudged out the police but like people dependent cells. Thank you what happened a massacre. And then you get into Luke. 182 and 36% of you do not have a sort polls show your code and by want. And the governor is a moderate pace sort. My. Just biblical. Persistent self defense of a slave get over it is perfectly okay do defend yourself and defend others. Many many of them references to that you're right. You know Amman not a big span of the eight BLU but you know I think did you. You don't aura that I mean like citi's spur demand. Interest in the ACLU is a little weird. And a lot times you say they're crazy they're doing all kind of weird stuff and then occasionally they will actually work labor they'll take a case of partner up with the knot in Ari. She got the issue you the very working together urge sometimes so. The economy. All the way across the board on the bill of rights were as the area's Second Amendment group they specialize in that. But yeah I'm I'm I'm understand sometimes or come off now they're too Mike must appreciate thanks for the call in to break is in New Jersey you. Thank frank. Hey come on utility got a couple if she's number one his. Why don't the manufacturers get together and when they're selling guns to the dealers. Why can't they push that the dealers really get on people of food and give up there exporting NRA. Wouldn't incentive at some kind of a file or read the bureau whatever. That's. There certainly are all right let me in an address that on the wheel motorcycle guy. A number of the manufacturers do a lot to help we are the locks put coupons and well for years Taurus actually gave away free RA membership for every gun they sold me to send them and you get free honorary membership. The issue and it's a challenge frankly is that. For the most part gun store very independent businesses and they're involved with trying to make eleven and try to profit and then. The manufacturer can only do so much and in many cases have been fracture actually doesn't even sell to the do. In fact most cases the gun maker doesn't sell guns earlier they sell guns to a distributor and the deer calls were these distributors the middleman to get their guns. So there's not a much connection there as you might think. But have barely shed all that I think it's great idea and I'm hopeful that there will be some communication and some are. Working on that sorry your second point. Okay the gun talk TV. A great product I hate to give give us wilt had put a great product to and could be Helio is terrific. Also you recommended a book deadly force. I think that is one of the finest books I've read that a long time. And I want to thank you for a recommending that book I think everybody should. It's gonna talk TV. Good deal Leo and repeatedly forced. The primal redo your look your your your monthly check will be in the mail I appreciate all the I. I think that the Detroit had a little bit you know it is true it is it is the great. Product in the I've learned so much from it took to do good talk and the book. I had to keep myself out of trouble. Totally new defense portrait but had to keep myself fed. Arnold I would make a little I would rather recommendation and our first person defender of our series on YouTube. You have to check down target by hackers go on keeps against self defense needs to. Look at all of the episodes of first person offender because there's a lot of holy cow and I never thought of that in that will be Google. Whoa what are they just do have that happen that happened so fast once you run up there she could have she could've stayed back she had to go but she ran up close what are. And we're here in the middle of you can't see when you watch what we are watching them on the screen go. Home is used to it you can analyze that you can learn from Australia check out first person defender on YouTube like for chuck what is out Texas hello jerk. China are. Want request and want to comment when he tried someone we are encouraged not to dealers and distributors Atlantic tractors on the show teach everybody in the entire truck trying to teach. They encourage people to show their owner Robby carts are on our IndyCar PR sorry Clark wore it like coming action. Now. Give me hackers some help old five feet. You know who. How it went silent salt water and courage stand in the furcal prediction number two come at each episode 300 like you look at what the pick a side so well also to which all. You. Yeah yeah. Bet there are also made the right ownership are gone it's a lot of stuff but Butler achieved the pulpit right in the site. And they're not lazy country forward but you know. You can get what the heck you're I think that the co leader of the hole we're doing with your side all right yeah well it actually. You know who are well. Yeah Malaysia and that in fact they like. It's. You just got Hampshire right if you get a double rifle they have to regulate. Them barrels they adjust them so that they issue to the same point of impact. To your point of they imported impact. Exact yard the other meaning back then and some new orders was. Oh a well regulated militia met one that was practice that was confident that bush prepared. But it had nothing to do with restrictions or controlled. Or. Limited. The that is they deficit came along 200 years later. You can't record a new definition to what they wrote then you have toward justice fully healed all about rituals. What do they mean when they said it what are the words mean then and that's what we have to pay attention to today. What's your big win to make a difference. Log onto our web site and take big guns drugs full. Www. Donned dark god go. Now once again opinion great regular contributor for the Washington tell I've experienced job. What oil oil oil world. One option of course we threw US senate never sure we just can't not do anything for a year or. They include. Hold confirmation hearings on whomever the president nominates. And chipper Joker person. And then when they get the next nominee that could hold hearings and simply. Reject. That person. Wouldn't word hope they wore at least an hour long memories original short memories they were remember. When justice Kagan. And justice Sotomayor. Out there in the hearings and lied lied lied lied lied through their teeth. About their views on the Second Amendment. Lie due to the senate. Can they remembered. Are bigger remembered do they have the guts and they find the wherewithal. There are slick and they find the basketballs. Needed. To do what needs to be done. Or will they will burn the pressure of the Washington media. Because the GOP is so afraid of being called bad name to Paul badly. It seems to be the motivating factor of them. Why they've continued to fold her why the continue to shaft. Us. Orders of their jobs or they get reelected. Source people are saying bad things about them. You give her sense of I have very little. Respect. For our elected officials on the GOP side you do you're right. Corey is on line one Dreyer and through Kansas hello Cory Edwards scored all of these church or school books. But Obama Dave. Bill very fortunate that I was just to the station commander in music got this because I have I've a question and I have faith in my want your opinion on our question. They've got hurt for a long time. It taxes has now rewritten. Their history books that the Second Amendment would now be stated simply as. You have the right to keep and bear arms. In a state militia. Cut and dry in other words you're gonna teach your children. And lecherous like Malaysia you don't have the ride even there are. So I don't know that true or false I'd like to know. I'd I don't know for sure I will I will tell you that I know that before the Heller decision. That was the official position of the United States government I listened to govern lawyers argue that in the Emerson case in the fifth Circuit Court of Appeals. And and they just judges they're said are you saying that no one has right Oregon. And the judge of the hour. Correction the lawyer from Gerber says that's correct if you're not in the National Guard you don't have a right to Oregon even if you are in the National Guard. You don't have a right Oregon yourself if you only have a right to have a guy on this issue do you while you are on duty. And that would be official position. Of the US government so. Is that a birdie put it being put into school books I would not be surprised once again a reminder to everyone looked in your child's school books. When it comes to history when it comes to talk about the constitution. That's why they make magic markers and sharply so we can strike that stuff out now your other points or. Okay Berkowitz you're resource should reach out appreciated you're right about that hell. About the validity of data about you can do better on. Some I met him call huge Keebler since a manmade you're helpless no no in the next. A little outlets that law would argue radio station go okay. I believe did a responsible person you don't know what all of our our I don't think irresponsible people should. So in an at and at that battle liberal thought they they wanted to take our guns period. But I think we can catch their mid week it it we can all within a solution knowledge of what I would ask you about the plausibility at this. And the chain of custody down others there's only out of format in place in some stage where you have a Parker did you CNN center's at Europe but every every. Barrel manufactured in the United States. Passed the test fired. Solana that test firing back that shell was shot look a block in jail. And a ballistics guess he's done. And ballistic Jesse was in attached to that particular weapon. Which could then be transferred to the retest the wholesaler. Which Adobe air transport to the retailer which had been returned targeted repeatedly in individual owner and it thanks so that they would be responsible looked up. Dissident on double lie so that it your look at that weapon collect a fingerprint database. Machine in a primary irresponsible matter. The last person that was in charge of that chain of custody. Would have the liability. You're what you're describing you ballistic fingerprinting has been tried a number of times. Moon. Mean billions not millions but billions. Of dollars have been. Done. Spit on ballistic fingerprinting. To date after billions of dollars have been spent or not a single. Crime. Has been solved with ballistic fingerprint not. More. All of this record keeping all these databases all this testing. All of this headache all this bureaucracy nice seeing go crime. Has ever been solved. From ballistic fingerprinting. It is simply another utopian that and here's the problem here here's the issue are good tall suspect due course. If you were then 100. To 1% of guns were ever used to commit a murder and that is about the right number. Why would we do business. Well I think our sought out and out. Not surprised that somebody had thought that they'd ever original thought these days I'm not cinema brilliant person to discredit me. I'm. Just saying that once we got to be some way. Well I guess just satisfied as the liberals seem to think it and by its. Dutch art work the deal Buford are here and let me stop erected ever get rich rewarding to go to further you can't satisfy them. It's like I am I'm good or should compromise through someone who wants to kill me when should occur Roger ice it's where to come to the Second Amendment. The anti gun forces are the nicest. Over constitution. They want to kill. The Second Amendment I truly do and the make no bones about it. And so there is no who compromise. But we'll there's no. Well we just do this today and they won't leave us alone is akin to throwing babies off the back of the slid while the wolves which this year. In hopes that the finally. The wolves will be satisfied with the the babies and they won't eat you. Doesn't work. We have compromise the compromise real compromise we have offered and they just keeping the baby's incumbent for more. What they want Jewish tradition he wore you. The Second Amendment and the closet. Hillary Clinton says right the record got it wrong. There is no individual right to keep and bear arms is she gets elected you gonna make sure that. Give us correct. 866. Talk here. Actually no none other then Alec grow. Noted constitutional. Scholar attorney. Who argue the Heller and McDonald decisions before the Supreme Court before Justice Scalia in the previous hour he says is very simple. If Barack Obama. Guess to put a justice on the Supreme Court. Where Hillary Clinton. Is able to put justices on the Supreme Court. Heller decision goes away in the rebel incision goes away in the Second Amendment for all intents and purposes goes away. These are lower still haven't prepared the sugar will be there you but. Already we have. Judges records. When they look at Heller decision. They don't decide on the basis of the majority opinion. Which is you do have a right keep an arms. There are you deciding cases on the basis of the minority opinion the losers in this case before version before they're saying yeah but. Real awkward justice Stephens said because we agree with that so we're gonna go with that. Already burned eking out we're losing bit by bit we're lead skiing are going right. Of course you're going to fix that the only way to fix. That. Is student then appealed to the Supreme Court to go back to the mystery date the court courts are not doing what you told them to do you shed. The Second Amendment is the right to keep and bear arms an individual right to keep and bear arms. You need to reinforce this with a lower courts yearning to tell them not get off. That is no mechanism. That is how it works. Already the lower courts are ignoring. Our they're saying you don't. Have a right to keep her arms so. No way to fix that is to go to the Supreme Court dot. If it's by for the other work. If you have right and another Obama. Nomination. Appointment. If you have Hillary Clinton appointment. 12 or three. Then what happens when the court simply won't take the case they'll let the lower. Court decision that anti secular members stay and there. Had simply how it works. So weak computer and say will not desperate they're veteran actually means that structure means that by the way have you read it. A well regulated militia. Being necessary to the security of our free state. The right of thought he poll to keep and bear arm news. Shall not be infringed you're noted does not actually guns and is not true firearms says. Arms that would include knives. Include possibly other things. What if solutions are well all that means is that all of the militia could have gotten to reload refresh. The debt and it was the First Amendment. A well educated populace being necessary to the security for free state the right of the keyboard people to keep. And read books. Shall not be infringed. Would anybody. Interpret that to mean that only. The well educated. And keep and read books are what they know instead. Apply common sense and slick O. The pushed phrase is to show why the sector phrase exist the right of a well educated. Populace. That's what we want. Therefore we get that. By having established a right to keep and read books. Or are they should be a well regulated militia the way we get that. Is the right of the people. And other in the word. People accused several times in the constitution always means individuals never ever this collective will collective concept there's a premier. Fantasy faltered July. Why do bodies with a partner Bobby Argo sort of Fuzzy by two buddies with a shuttle Marshall Texas Tripoli. Hey Tom how you don't. Win. Well I think equipment is closer to have it planned. How many billion approved or rejected. I think people are Garnett to erase some kind of they'll come. And you know some of these senators their summer but more per amid all the right notes and make sure I would do it over. In our guy I don't like it booted it straight. With equity intranet I don't know actually omit the whirlwind I think golf well equipped with the purpose Carlo. And I I don't know about you across to the poet. Two people in these middle override vote perhaps today it worked out lukewarm on gun ownership. Well let me jump in because we're and you say the other sleigh will run into our culture our float so what I got a call we'll miss you want that's where he still could. You got to understand that you look at the patriots are worst senators Eric's going to be here when he comes back in the states. I'm gonna show up there I'm gonna go total total Ida and excited necktie if you will. And with a pair of this conversation if you are going to take my call in person. I've I've just stalwart ally and one Matthews with a seven Metairie Louisiana hey Matthew what are your mind. Well thank you dot com or call log data bitter end up bill Cassidy an ominous. Give them only had not let anything come to look for what what we US and it almost the GOP side and the ya. There can't be the end seesawed they're more certain corporate US chamber of commerce wants and what they're Boehner want. There'd applauded got a you know I got the guts to tell us to take. Into what they're I don't think there's donors law. I'll talk were what to kick which he did a great port appreciate it and thank Google brings me to report. That's not exactly wrong here. Yes there are some that are running for reelection and those people might be more inclined to listen. But of dollars Duce speak. And we can use that to our advantage. If you error so inclined if you say I would like to win. How would you do that well let's all get together. We put our money together. So that we can have some impact because the money I hit a and the money you have. And the money that your friend heads. Individually there's not a lot. But what do we put all poor let's pick a number five million of us together. Tom I know or you're going with this yes you do as you're just so clever. Reports five million. Of us together. If each of us in the five million Witten got another buddy do enjoy and Ono don't see the American. We were to Libya. You get so much attention you drop in there were ten million votes and ten million people who give money. And the money that donations from ten million people. That's called grass roots activism. That's what we do we get together whether it's a Second Amendment foundation. Or of the NRA error or state group. It's grass roots activism it is small. It is just petitioning. Our government. It is letting them know in a way that gets your attention because we don't have Ichiro says that if he beauty megaphone. But sports altogether we can build a really big megaphone. Mr. tipped happening at the door to detect it we can hit their door with a sledge hammer. Walk in and say where here's the there we won't be ignored. So long. To bring the surrender a personal level. Are you here and are you and. Sargodha. Are you remember have you donated. Have you contributed to have you gotten involved. Aren't you just have sidelined complainer. Tunnels say that you're gonna make people live I don't care. I just don't care anymore. If you're a gun owner who doesn't belong to a gun rights group to ensure that America. Is it okay. Ramel after everything. You're voice. Ports. How you're grown but you don't belong to any of these political groups rarely. Then shut up all way I don't wanna be with you. You'll worse than nothing there's you're pretending to be helpful. But if you're rewarded get involved if you're be a part of Britain's. Failure poser. And you sign up the new Jordan then you make sure that you or. Renewed that your yeah. Because that's what effects could take every single one of them he signed up beside your wife Senator Clinton signed dog after you sign up. It's gonna take money money money money. Because money talks. And he has walked. We're all please. Bearded operator part traders come from an early good will we'll be talking about that only come about from a good Osama.